Rapture and the AntiChrist

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Rapture doctrine of Protestants, Evangelists, Baptists, Pentecostals etc. Actually the rapture is not ascribed to only one religion, but it's universal. People will be deceived from all religions and the non-religious. The pre-tribulation theory was a result of the Protestant reformation.

This is probably the most important topic to discuss in the Bible, because it involves the unforgivable sin spoken of in Luke 12:9-12, and throughout the NT.

The rapture and pre-tribulation theory was dreamed up by Margaret MacDonald, a 15-year old Scottish/Irish girl who supposedly had a vision in 1830.

The rapture is what many Christians believe to be that Jesus Christ is going to come for them before the great tribulation. The Bible thumpers base this theory on I Thessalonians 4:

The subject in the following verses is where the dead are.

“But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Wherefore comfort one another with these words.” I Thessalonians 4:13-18

Let’s examine these verses:

“But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.”

asleep=koimao in the original Greek, which means decease, to be dead. This is talking about people that are already dead, not people that are living on earth now. The second our flesh body dies our soul goes back to God:

“Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.” Ecclesiastes 12:7

Lets go back to I Thessalonians:

“For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.”

prevent=phthano in the original Greek, which means to precede before hand, to have arrived at already. We are still talking about where the dead are, the subject has not changed. The dead are already with Jesus. The people alive when Jesus returns will still be here.

“For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:”

This tells us when Jesus will return and not before. This is not the rapture. The rapture is a lie and cannot be found in God's word. This is talking about the second coming of Jesus at the end of the tribulation. Jesus will come at the seventh trump and not before the seventh trump for anyone. Those that have died already rise first because they are already with Jesus. The second we die, we go back to our Creator.

“Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”

This happens after the tribulation when Jesus returns as Lord of lords and King of kings. This is not talking about a rapture, there is no rapture. The clouds in that verse are symbolic for a mass of people:

”Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,” Hebrews 12:1

When Jesus returns at the seventh trump, the people alive on earth at that time will be changed into their spiritual bodies in an instant.

”In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.” I Corinthians 15:52-53

The rapture is a lie from Satan trying to trick God's children into believing in an easy way out. Satan will come back to this earth with supernatural powers saying he is Christ here to rapture you away, but it is a lie, it’s a one way ticket to hell.

God's word does say something about people teaching you to fly away to try to save your soul:

“To wit, the prophets of Israel which prophesy concerning Jerusalem, and which see visions of peace for her, and there is no peace, saith the Lord GOD.
Likewise, thou son of man, set thy face against the daughters of thy people, which prophesy out of their own heart; and prophesy thou against them,
And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows to all armholes, and make kerchiefs upon the head of every stature to hunt souls! Will ye hunt the souls of my people, and will ye save the souls alive that come unto you?
And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?
Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.
Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver my people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:
Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver my people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.” Ezekiel 13:16-23

Their will be no true peace until Jesus returns to this earth after the antichrist has been here and not before, for anyone. Some people believe in the false peace of the rapture, and it is just that, a false peace. The prophets talked about here are false prophets not teaching the true word of God. People telling you that you don't have to read the book of Revelation because you'll be gone. They are lying to you, there is no rapture and God is against people that tell you there is. People who know the truth must tell the truth to God's other children. The ones that prophesy out of their own heart are the ones that go on teaching the lie that there is a rapture when God himself said that it's not true. The pillows and kerchiefs these false prophets use to cover the outstretched arms of Jesus by teaching the lie of the rapture. The people that teach others the rapture are leading them right to the arms of the false Messiah. Nowhere in the word of God does it say that Jesus will come for anybody before the great tribulation. God asked if these false prophets will save these people that they lie to by teaching them the rapture. When in fact these false prophets are leading these people straight to the spiritual death, which is the antichrist. Only Jesus can save you. God himself is against the teaching of a quick escape to save your soul. God is saying that there is no rapture. The true Christ is not coming back for anyone until after the antichrist has already been on earth, God said so. The Lord is against people that teach lies to his children about the rapture. It covers the outstretched arms of the true Christ by leading his children right into the arms of the antichrist. God will save his people from the lie of the rapture by giving the truth in his word. Read the word on your own and ask God to give you understanding in his word so you can see the truth about the rapture.

In II Thessalonians it tells us there are certain things that must happen before Jesus returns to this earth.

“Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;” II Thessalonians 2:1-3

Beseech means to ask or request a person to do something. This is telling us to pay attention because these verses tells us what must happen before Jesus returns. Don't believe people when they say Jesus can come at any time. There are things that must happen before he returns. Never allow anyone to deceive you, read God's word with understanding. These verses tell us that Jesus will not return until the son of perdition is revealed. Perdition means to perish and die. Satan is the only one who has been sentenced to death by God so far.

”Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.” Ezekiel 28:11-19

”While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Thy name: those that Thou gavest Me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.” John 17:12

II Thessalonians tells us that Jesus will not come for anyone until Satan is revealed. There is no rapture. Jesus will not come for anybody until that happens. Satan is the one that deceives the world and that can be read here:

”And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.” Revelation 12:9

“And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.” Revelation 20:10

Back to II Thessalonians:

“Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.” II Thessalonians 2:4-7

Satan is the antichrist and will return to this earth with supernatural powers able to have lighting fall from heaven. Many will be deceived and think that he is Jesus here to rapture them away. Satan will sit in the temple of God which is in Jerusalem. Satan will be cast out of heaven down to earth to play the role of Jesus Christ. He will say that he is here to rapture you away, but as always Satan is lying. Satan will be cast out of heaven by Michael in the last days.

”And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.” Revelation 12:7-9

This will happen before the true Jesus returns to this earth. The true Christ will not come for any one until Satan is already here on earth.

“And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:” II Thessalonians 2:8

This is when Satan is on this earth saying he is Jesus here to rapture you away. Then the true Christ returns to earth and Satan is bound for a thousand years.

“And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.” Revelation 20:1-3

Let’s continue:

“Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.” II Thessalonians 2:9-12

People who don't read God's word with understanding and do not believe in the truth of his word will go on believing in lies. We are to study God's word:

”Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.” Timothy 2:15

The rapture is a total lie from Satan himself. Nowhere in God's word does it say that Jesus will come back for anyone before Satan comes to earth as the antichrist. Keep your eyes open and be familiar with God's Word. God will place the spirit of slumber on people who never had a chance. In another words, you cannot commit the unforgivable sin in ignorance, but they will get their chance during the Millenium, and even then, many of them will fall short and deny the Holy Spirit to speak through them.

[Stella]

Could you please summarize up in 2 sentences what is your subject here? Thanks:) Is it connected to the second coming of Christ?

I always admire your detailed investigation into certain religious questions, are you writing maybe a study in theology?

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Originally Posted by Stella

Could you please summarize up in 2 sentences what is your subject here? Thanks:) Is it connected to the second coming of Christ?

Yes, the rapture teaches that the Messiah will come before the great tribulation to fly you away. But the Bible teaches that the False Messiah will come first to deceive you.

I always admire your detailed investigation into certain religious questions, are you writing maybe a study in theology?

Just trying to motivate people to read the Bible rather than trust the words of teachers.

[Vitoria]

Originally Posted by Stella

Could you please summarize up in 2 sentences what is your subject here? Thanks:) Is it connected to the second coming of Christ?

I always admire your detailed investigation into certain religious questions, are you writing maybe a study in theology?

if you dont like why do you read it as far as i know youre not lebanese so let the lebanese talk bout what they want right?
stop mocking ok read and learn

[Claudia]

It's true that lebanese people has a real tendency to talk about religious issues, that's right, I personally like a lot to talk about it. Anyway, there is no need to be harsh.
I think Caesar always brings interesting threads, but it's a pity the fact he never agrees with me

In first place, Rapture does not appear in the Bible, it is only the term used by Christians to describe the moment when Christ comes for us. This is very different from the Second Coming of Jesus. In the Rapture, Jesus is coming for His Church (you can read it on John 14:1-3, 1 Thess. 4:14-17); in the Second Coming, Jesus is coming with His Church (Col 3:4, Zech 14:5, Jude 14, Rev 19:14). There are more differences:
Rapture: Only Christians will see Him (1 John 3:2, 1 Cor 15:52);Happens in a moment too fast for eyes to see (1 Cor 15:52)

Second Coming: Every one will see Him (Rev. 1:7); It's a slow coming. (Zech 12:10 Matt 24:30, Rev 1:7)

With the Rapture our bodies will be changed into glorified immortal bodies. In the Second Coming Jesus will be finally reigning as the King of All.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Originally Posted by Claudia

It's true that lebanese people has a real tendency to talk about religious issues, that's right, I personally like a lot to talk about it. Anyway, there is no need to be harsh.
I think Caesar always brings interesting threads, but it's a pity the fact he never agrees with me

In first place, Rapture does not appear in the Bible, it is only the term used by Christians to describe the moment when Christ comes for us. This is very different from the Second Coming of Jesus. In the Rapture, Jesus is coming for His Church (you can read it on John 14:1-3, 1 Thess. 4:14-17); in the Second Coming, Jesus is coming with His Church (Col 3:4, Zech 14:5, Jude 14, Rev 19:14). There are more differences:
Rapture: Only Christians will see Him (1 John 3:2, 1 Cor 15:52);Happens in a moment too fast for eyes to see (1 Cor 15:52)

Second Coming: Every one will see Him (Rev. 1:7); It's a slow coming. (Zech 12:10 Matt 24:30, Rev 1:7)

With the Rapture our bodies will be changed into glorified immortal bodies. In the Second Coming Jesus will be finally reigning as the King of All.

Claudia, read all of Mark 13, maybe we can agree :). The second coming of the Christ will happen, but only after the False Messiah (Satan) has come to rapture those who will deny the Holy Spirit to speak through them.

"but when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do you premeditate; but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye; for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost." Mark 13:11

[Claudia]

Originally Posted by Gaius Julius Caesar

Claudia, read all of Mark 13, maybe we can agree :). The second coming of the Christ will happen, but only after the False Messiah (Satan) has come to rapture those who will deny the Holy Spirit to speak through them.

"but when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do you premeditate; but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye; for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost." Mark 13:11

The Second Coming of Jesus may happen after the Anti-Christ (not Satan himself).
And Rapture is not an invention of anyone, it is mentioned many times in the Scriptures. Corinthians 15:51-53 - "Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed- in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality."

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Originally Posted by Claudia

The Second Coming of Jesus may happen after the Anti-Christ (not Satan himself).
And Rapture is not an invention of anyone, it is mentioned many times in the Scriptures. Corinthians 15:51-53 - "Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed- in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality."

Claudia, have you never read the great book of Revelations? In Mark 13 don't you know who the "abomination of desolation" is? Why didn't you address all the biblical sources that I provided in my long post? Did you actually read my post? " The abomination of desolation" is another name of Satan. The devil is not a two-headed monster like some false teachers or hollywood movies would have you believe. After all, what chance does Satan have in deceiving you as the Christ if he's a two-headed monster? He will be very charming and will speak very softly twisting the word of God as he did in the Garden of Eden. Please recognize the figure of speech used in the Bible regarding Satan; he's no dragon.

Would you like to explain Corinthians 15:51-53, because there is no rapture there. Are you aware of the events that occur at the 6th trump? before the 7th trump sounds?

Claudia, I don't think you read my post. Read it first, then address the sources.

[Claudia]

Originally Posted by Gaius Julius Caesar

Claudia, have you never read the great book of Revelations? In Mark 13 don't you know who the "abomination of desolation" is? Why didn't you address all the biblical sources that I provided in my long post? Did you actually read my post? " The abomination of desolation" is another name of Satan. The devil is not a two-headed monster like some false teachers or hollywood movies would have you believe. After all, what chance does Satan have in deceiving you as the Christ if he's a two-headed monster? He will be very charming and will speak very softly twisting the word of God as he did in the Garden of Eden. Please recognize the figure of speech used in the Bible regarding Satan; he's no dragon.

Would you like to explain Corinthians 15:51-53, because there is no rapture there. Are you aware of the events that occur at the 6th trump? before the 7th trump sounds?

Claudia, I don't think you read my post. Read it first, then address the sources.

Yes, I read your post but I don't agree with your conclusions.
You wrote:

Don't believe people when they say Jesus can come at any time. There are things that must happen before he returns.

I tell you that Jesus can come at any time. He could come right now if He wanted. There are things that must happen before it but how do you know these things didn't already happen? Only God knows that. This is why we should all be prepared.

Satan is the Antichrist and will return to this earth with supernatural powers able to have lighting fall from heaven

Satan is not the anti-Christ. Satan is already living around us. He is the one who causes the suffering and pain. anti-Christ will be someone who serves Satan. The anti-Christ will catch many and he will do glorious things to fool people.

About Corinthians 15:51-53 - in this passage Saint Paul adds something more to the notion of the Rapture in 1 Thessalonians. St. Paul believes that people with normal bodies cannot attain Heaven. Their bodies would be instantly changed to a form of spiritual holy body so that they may enter Heaven. This is totally related with the Rapture.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Originally Posted by Claudia

Yes, I read your post but I don't agree with your conclusions.

Why do you disagree? Care to address the sources I provided?

I tell you that Jesus can come at any time. He could come right now if He wanted. There are things that must happen before it but how do you know these things didn't already happen? Only God knows that. This is why we should all be prepared.

When did the false Messiah come? Have you been "delivered up" to face him?
I think not...

Satan is not the anti-Christ. Satan is already living around us. He is the one who causes the suffering and pain. anti-Christ will be someone who serves Satan. The anti-Christ will catch many and he will do glorious things to fool people.

I thought you read my post

”And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.” Revelation 12:9

About Corinthians 15:51-53 - in this passage Saint Paul adds something more to the notion of the Rapture in 1 Thessalonians. St. Paul believes that people with normal bodies cannot attain Heaven. Their bodies would be instantly changed to a form of spiritual holy body so that they may enter Heaven. This is totally related with the Rapture.

Claudia, read the 7 trumps. The true Christ is not coming for anyone until the 7th trump. Are you aware of the event that occurs at the 6th trump?