Executions in Iran

[Xena]

Originally Posted by Abu Ruman

No one is condoning Saudia or Turkey's policies.

I can pick on them too (starting with Saudi Arabia).

Wrong is wrong and thats where we're drawing the line. Not to mention, the thread topic is about Iran.

wlak eh i know! i wasn't talking about you!
i was talking about those articles we always read and it's only about Iran!
i'm saying that because here in Belgium my friends always bring me articles dealing with those things in Iran, and never in Saudi Arabia, or Egypt or the gulf!
they recently started to talk about Turkey since they don't want it to join the EU!
so did you get my point here?

i agree with you! i know what's happening there is wrong, specially after i watched a documentary about the execution of a teenage girl there!
the system is easily being manipulated specially in small towns!

bass, i just don't like the way Iran is being picked at!
when there's a political advantage behind it for people i don't support, i just can't participate in the bashing!

[Abu Ruman]

Originally Posted by Xena

wlak eh i know! i wasn't talking about you!
i was talking about those articles we always read and it's only about Iran!
i'm saying that because here in Belgium my friends always bring me articles dealing with those things in Iran, and never in Saudi Arabia, or Egypt or the gulf!
they recently started to talk about Turkey since they don't want it to join the EU!
so did you get my point here?

i agree with you! i know what's happening there is wrong, specially after i watched a documentary about the execution of a teenage girl there!
the system is easily being manipulated specially in small towns!

bass, i just don't like the way Iran is being picked at!
when there's a political advantage behind it for people i don't support, i just can't participate in the bashing!

Thank you.

So I guess execution of a 16 year old girl wasn't propaganda aired by agents of the zionists (which is some people's logic).

[coralie]

Originally Posted by Stella

Sadly women has not equal rights in the so called islamic countries. In another thread many of you prooved they are not true muslims if they dont respect women or abuse them, so these countries are not even true islamic ones. The hypocrites, aside abusing their own ppl, they bring shame to their religion too.

i am not protecting Iran here i dont realy agree what is happening there . but again when i want to talk about womens rights in Iran i will have to do so as well all over the world i will not take one side of the story . we are living in a world full of extremisme the islamic world made out of the woman just a shadow she looks more like a ghost in her outfit (shador , burka ..) in her restricted life ,rights , existence as a whole and the free world made of her just a sensual tool and i am sure you know what i mean ;).

there is not place any more for the moderate ! women in both cases is not given her right value she is a product . just a product they use each his way .

we are talking about rights and freedom well if feedom should be to deffend certain values its fine with me , but if it is just to attack an aspect of the bad disregarding the rest in the rest of the world well i will not call this freedom this is an abusif freedom ! now Iran is retarded because of this subject ok well i find the rest of the world more retarded (you call it modernisme and open mind ) when i see women used in so many bad ways . you know being covered by a shador is not the only shamefull thing ... i think you can guess what i mean here ... being partialy naked in promotions pictures and movies , drugged , abused , used ... is as bad as the shador both are extreem . both worlds are bad as equals . full stop .

when i see what is hapening to the youngters in my country some times i wonder if freedom has boundries or it is a stupid word we hide behind to qualify our self as Better / advanced / modern !

[Stella]

Coralie, its about Iran now, but yes we can discuss other parts of the world where women are abused as well.

And the abuse of women in Thailand for example can not serve as an excuse to Iran.

These are internal issues, and reflects on the society.

Most important is to have a strong law enforcement institution based on democratic values, which will ensure the basic human rights, and will eliminate discrimination of any kind.

That is of course ideal, but many countries are close to it, while others are doing worse and some are truly bad in it.

The regimes who keep women under oppression, or intimidate them, in name of whatever religion is just not acceptale, they are not only abusing their own people too but the religion as well, thus creating just more misconceptions and hatred.

The very only way out from these regimes if the people themselves stand up and revolt against the regime or leaders they dont like, there is no other way.

And again, this is the only way for Lebanon as well, Lebanon shall not await any salvation from the neighbouring countries or overseas, it can count only on their own brave people!

[Abufijli]

Originally Posted by Abu Ruman

No thats not fair (and I am against it). But lets be honest, from the standpoint of marriage (at least Islamically) which holds the man as the money-maker and the woman as the mother and care-taker, that seems more plausible for the woman and respects her dignity more - but only in that context of pure marriage values.

And in a world where woman constantly suffer, thats a first..

Still, thats not the same as taking away a woman's kids or stating her intelligence as half that of a man's, during a court hearing. In my opinion, Iranian history has demonstrated far more potential than Australia's (if what you tell me is true on that inheritance issue) and that is why I think we should not sink so low. We should return to the time where man and woman, Muslim and non-Muslim were treated as equals, no matter what (including issues of inheritance).

But thank you for conceding with the struggle of woman in Iran. I respect that.

The real beef I have with these topics is that the are concentrating on one country while ignoring the rest of the world. Unfortunately, this is done for political purposes and not for the purpose of advancing human rights, if that was the case and the west really showed that it cared about human rights just for the sanctity of our rights then I would throw all my support behind them. I just can not see past the hypocrisy in our world today.

[paraquat]

Originally Posted by Gaius Julius Caesar

Let's worry about their uranium enrichment program, persecution of women

I am not worried

[JD06]

Originally Posted by coralie

i am not protecting Iran here i dont realy agree what is happening there . but again when i want to talk about womens rights in Iran i will have to do so as well all over the world i will not take one side of the story . we are living in a world full of extremisme the islamic world made out of the woman just a shadow she looks more like a ghost in her outfit (shador , burka ..) in her restricted life ,rights , existence as a whole and the free world made of her just a sensual tool and i am sure you know what i mean ;).

there is not place any more for the moderate ! women in both cases is not given her right value she is a product . just a product they use each his way .

we are talking about rights and freedom well if feedom should be to deffend certain values its fine with me , but if it is just to attack an aspect of the bad disregarding the rest in the rest of the world well i will not call this freedom this is an abusif freedom ! now Iran is retarded because of this subject ok well i find the rest of the world more retarded (you call it modernisme and open mind ) when i see women used in so many bad ways . you know being covered by a shador is not the only shamefull thing ... i think you can guess what i mean here ... being partialy naked in promotions pictures and movies , drugged , abused , used ... is as bad as the shador both are extreem . both worlds are bad as equals . full stop .

when i see what is hapening to the youngters in my country some times i wonder if freedom has boundries or it is a stupid word we hide behind to qualify our self as Better / advanced / modern !

i understand what ur saying and agree with u bas i think the solution to these problems is education and to explain to children tht wat thy feel is naturel not make thm think tht thinking about sex is a sin and tht thyr going to hell and definetly not something anyone should be killed for. trust me i wouldnt never have been interested in trying drugs,porn.... if someone (maybe not parents since its taboo for old generation lebanese to talk about sex infront of thr kids bas older brothers,sisters)told me its no big deal its natural to want to try it bas be carefull ,this this and this can happen to u if do it.. bas tell someone tht sex is bad, drugs r bad, porn is bad, ur going to hell if u do it, god will hate u , the government will kill u ...it doesnt work, its been tryed b4 and it didnt work, education and communication is the best treatment

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Originally Posted by Dalzi

Women in Iran are not persecuted but respected and protected. Weird how you follow the "western" concept of persecution!

Dalzi, that can't be a serious statement on your part. The difference between respect & persecution is like day & night. I think Abu Ruman & Stella covered this issue extensively in their posts, and I have nothing to add. I'm sure you know that I'm not exactly the "liberal type", especially when it comes to social issues. But respecting and recognizing womens rights has nothing to do with conservatism or liberalism, but humanity.

[Omeros]

Originally Posted by Xena

wlak eh i know! i wasn't talking about you!
i was talking about those articles we always read and it's only about Iran!
i'm saying that because here in Belgium my friends always bring me articles dealing with those things in Iran, and never in Saudi Arabia, or Egypt or the gulf!
they recently started to talk about Turkey since they don't want it to join the EU!
so did you get my point here?

i agree with you! i know what's happening there is wrong, specially after i watched a documentary about the execution of a teenage girl there!
the system is easily being manipulated specially in small towns!

bass, i just don't like the way Iran is being picked at!
when there's a political advantage behind it for people i don't support, i just can't participate in the bashing!

اتعرفين لم ايران من يشهر بها فقط؟

ايران قبل احمد النجاد كانت نحكومة من قبل الخمنئي وهو كان من الاصاحيين الا انه مشهور بانفتاحه على العالم وكانت هناك ما يسمى بالحرية ربما نسبية الا انها حرية نسبة للوضع الاني ....مع الانتخابات وفوز النجاد المتحجر تغيرت الاية وباتت ايران محكومة وفقا للشريعة ةالتاويلات الدينية فالجينز والافلام الاباحية باتوا ممنوعين ....
اذا هذه النقلة النوعية بذاتها شكلت نقطة صادمة بالتالي تبعاتها ستشكل محور احاديث فان ربما منعوا الحجاب ستقوم الدنيا وتجلس ...

[Abu Ruman]

Originally Posted by Gaius Julius Caesar

Dalzi, that can't be a serious statement on your part. The difference between respect & persecution is like day & night. I think Abu Ruman & Stella covered this issue extensively in their posts, and I have nothing to add. I'm sure you know that I'm not exactly the "liberal type", especially when it comes to social issues. But respecting and recognizing womens rights has nothing to do with conservatism or liberalism, but humanity.

This has nothing to do with liberalism. And I'm tired of people reducing basic human rights down to 'liberalism.' There is a fine line between right and wrong. I am an ethicist before I am a liberal. The former is a universal concept that transcends all relative cultural values. Something is either ethical or unethical. Period.

Beating a woman mercilessly in the street, until she's drenched in blood all over her face, followed by her arrest, in front of her little child, is disgusting, to say the least. And for what? For not dressing 'Islamic enough.' Anyone who wants to overlook this should really re-examine their conscience. Taking away a woman's child and giving it to her husband until the kid is 18, is an abomination and insult to human dignity. For anyone to justify it on the grounds of what some guy in a beard dictated 27 years ago in 'accordance with Islam' is remarkable. I dont care if thats true Islam, false Islam, or out of a Dr. Seuss book, its just disgusting and wrong. I dare anyone who condones it to weigh it against the love of their own child and imagine being in the situation of those women (interestingly enough, no one makes references to the dictums of liberal ayatollahs which contradict Khomeini's standpoint on this issue of guardianship in the case of divorce, perhaps because they give Khomeini the status of prophethood, I dont know).

Of course when it happens under the Taliban or Saudia, some people are quick to condemn it because of those 'uneducated illiterates' who misrepresent Islam. But when the mollahs in Iran do it, we have to 'respect their culture' (of death, in my opinion) and any opposition to it from the Iranian people is deemed as being channelled through the 'agency of zionism.'

Hypocrisy never runs low in this world.