Open question to FPM activists: Do you accept this attitude?

[Fakhr eddine 1618]

Originally Posted by Bazek

Any political Party members are a reflection of the society, you will have the Good, the Bad and the Ugly, FPM is no difference in that matter.

Even the Lebanese army has the same symptoms.

The solution is more democracy, free elections to all positions, let the Good decide the % of Bad & Ugly and not the opposite.

This is True, Platon republic does not exist

However, the majority of members give the "image de Marque", like france is known by cheese and wine, but does not mean all french cheese or wine is good

[Red Phoenix]

this is the most interesting and none-pointless thread in a decade here

there seems a lot to be said but everybody knows that publicly is not the place to say it

anyhows, it goes without saying that fpm as a party has some issues here and there

but i'm not a partisan, it's a matter of principle with me to not be a partisan in any party, so both my knowledge and rights to comment on this are very limited

and so, i listen :)

[Bazek]

Originally Posted by Fakhr eddine 1618

This is True, Platon republic does not exist

However, the majority of members give the "image de Marque", like france is known by cheese and wine, but does not mean all french cheese or wine is good

Agree, that is why I talked about %

% of Good in FPM is higher than the % of the Bad & Ugly as far as I know unless someone will correct me.

There is a duty for the Good ones to turn the bad/Ugly ones into an opportunity to be Good, if some decide not to change then expose them publicly.

Change & Reform start from within before spreading it outside.

Comrade Bassam is doing the right thing by exposing the bad & ugly, now the future voters have to take the responsibility to kick them out by not voting to them.

FPM for many is not just a political party, it is a way of life.

[Lebanesegirl]

Originally Posted by Red Phoenix

this is the most interesting and none-pointless thread in a decade here

there seems a lot to be said but everybody knows that publicly is not the place to say it

anyhows, it goes without saying that fpm as a party has some issues here and there

but i'm not a partisan, it's a matter of principle with me to not be a partisan in any party, so both my knowledge and rights to comment on this are very limited

and so, i listen :)

No actually I think ur wrong even though ur not a member of the party (so am I) ur opinion is very important as any other FPMer out there! I personally don't need a card to prove my love and respect to GMA/FPM, and me as a supporter when I see something going wrong or feel something should be changed I say it loud and clear because I want the best for the party. And you do the same if u care about FPM and its future u should share ur thoughts to try and fix what's going wrong!

[The Jade]

The real problem ya Lebanesegirl is that as much as you're gonna say things loud and clear.

It will have to pass by many steps before getting to the right EAR:

1) The hardcore blinded Aounists: These people will defend anything the FPM and Michel Aoun do. They will attack you with the harshest words and treat you like a traitor who has been paid by Saad Hariri

2) The hardcore Aounists: These guys are here to support the blind ones, they are smarter than the others, so they use them as a shield.

3) The over enthusiastic supporters: These people see the mistakes from time to time but refuse to talk about them since "GMA knows best". They talk about a small mishap here and there, but the moment Michel Aoun goes on TV to tell them that what he did was right, they start to balance between this phase and the hardcore Aounist one.

4) The FPM supporters: Now there are many of this kind but very few who have the courage to stand up when something goes wrong and even fewer who would get it to the right EAR

5) Michel Aoun's garde rapprochée: Now these are the real danger. These people think that by screening the information they would be helping the leader, whereas they would be manipulating the info depending on their benefits.


So, all in all, if you manage to pass by these 5 phases (which would take a huge amount of effort, will and endurance) you'll still have to get past "THE EAR".

And the latter is no other than Michel Aoun because unfortunately the party is all about him. He can sack you and he can make you a king.

So, still wondering why the FPM is a huge machine that is having problems to take-off ?

[coralie]

Originally Posted by Comrade Bassam

To say that this attitude is happening in FPM. W hayde ba3da hayyneh 2eddem gheir echya 3ala kell el so3od w bi kell zewyeh men el tayyar. This is why I always used to comment with one word "sterouna" when someone mentions corruption in some other older threads.

Now that you know this attitude exists, why do you care about the names since I am promising they will be accordingly humiliated?

you are promissing they will be accordingly humiliated ? sorry but this is not enough not for me anyway !

when we talk about corruption , bad behavior , big mistakes , and we keep saying we want accountability we do not mean the final judgement should be a "humiliation" . chou ya3ni humiliation eno 3ayato 3aleh ??? ya nousso .

if a person makes a mistake using his/her "position" in FPM he/she should be questioned and accordingly pay for this mistake . if the damage is bigger then a simple mistake the person should be severely scold and kicked out with a public statement to let everyone knows we do not accept any thing of this sort happening within our ranks .

but when we keep hiding names because it is "unethical" to reveal them , w men dour w men 7our w men zet kalem ma hadan am yefham chi , eno ehhhh there is a problem bas sorry ma fina nssami la2ano it is unethical bas we keep hitting on FPM and nagging about bad things happening ..sorry but can you tell me how things will change ? if those bad apples are not exposed once twice and 100 times others will follow heik heik ma hadan rah yestarji yefdahon ! so we start with 2 or three or 100 bad apples and we end up with the whole basket . every time i ask tayeb chou fi ? min elli 3emil heik i get the same answer: khalina sektin ma fina nehki !!! leich ? wlak khalas ...and they close the subject ... eno bi zeto el ftil w ba3dein bi oulo ma fina nsami baleha ahssan unethical w blablabla !!!!! eh iza ma fikon tehko lakan ma teftaho el mawdou3 men aslo .

you have a proof you have a story and you have names then go ahead bad people should be exposed and kicked out wa illa inutil nkafi bi kel hal dibejeh it is leading nowhere . we have to start somewhere when we see something wrong dont shut up gather proof never forget you are the nerves of this parti not those who sit behind their desks am bi nazro w ya3mlo 3anatir .

[Greg Davis]

When the influence of political groups in a country exceeds their constitutional limitations to a point where they affect law and order, and other facets that form governing bodies who are supposed to run the country, not only do these groups hinder the roles of authorities, and reduce their effectiveness, but tend to create a sub-culture of criminals who hide behind the blanket these political groups have created.

To erradicate such behaviour, all we need to do is to revert back to government institutions particularly when it comes to law and order.

The more cover the FPM give their political allies, the harder and longer will it take to contain them.

Sorry about the analogy, but my neighbour had a pet bull terrior guard dog. He injected it with steriods to improve its guarding capabilities. Common Side affects of steriods are hysteria and erratic behaviour. One day, the dog was so high it lost control and mauled its owner, disfiguring him.

What FPM leaders need to do is to stop and ask themselves what does the FPM represent, and if status-quo is a means to achieve the end result they are working so hard to achieve?

[>Watani<]

Originally Posted by the jade

the real problem ya lebanesegirl is that as much as you're gonna say things loud and clear.

It will have to pass by many steps before getting to the right ear:

1) the hardcore blinded aounists: These people will defend anything the fpm and michel aoun do. They will attack you with the harshest words and treat you like a traitor who has been paid by saad hariri

2) the hardcore aounists: These guys are here to support the blind ones, they are smarter than the others, so they use them as a shield.

3) the over enthusiastic supporters: These people see the mistakes from time to time but refuse to talk about them since "gma knows best". They talk about a small mishap here and there, but the moment michel aoun goes on tv to tell them that what he did was right, they start to balance between this phase and the hardcore aounist one.

4) the fpm supporters: Now there are many of this kind but very few who have the courage to stand up when something goes wrong and even fewer who would get it to the right ear

5) michel aoun's garde rapprochée: Now these are the real danger. These people think that by screening the information they would be helping the leader, whereas they would be manipulating the info depending on their benefits.


So, all in all, if you manage to pass by these 5 phases (which would take a huge amount of effort, will and endurance) you'll still have to get past "the ear".

And the latter is no other than michel aoun because unfortunately the party is all about him. He can sack you and he can make you a king.

So, still wondering why the fpm is a huge machine that is having problems to take-off ?

سأكتفي بقول القليل لأن كل ما قيل هنا يدلّ على أن الجميع مازالوا صغاراً في السياسة وهذا يشملني أيضاً
العماد عون أخطأ ويخطىء من خلال ثقته ببعض الأشخاص، من خلال خطاباته التي تخسره معارك إنتخابية كالبترون والكورة والأشرفية (وهذا ليس كما تفضلّ البعض بالقول بسبب أحداث 7 أيار). بسبب شفافية وصدقيّة وصراحة هذا الرجل الذي لا يعرف أن يكون سياسياً لأن السياسة الناجحة بحاجة إلى الكذب والوعود الكاذبة والخداع والغشّ، فيقع أحياناً في الخطأ، كذلك الأمر يجري على سماحة السيد حسن نصرالله. هؤلاء الرجلين ليسا رجال سياسة
فجلّ من يخطىء، ولكن في الثوابت الوطنيّة لا أسمح لأحد أن يتلفظ بأيّ كلمة عن العماد عون
في المسائل الأمنية والسلميّة والإبتعاد عن الفتن الطائفية فلا أحد يمكن أن يتنكرّ لما يقوم به العماد عون من مجهود كبير للحفاظ على وجودنا نحن الذين نحبّه ونحبّ الوطن من خلاله
كل الأخطاء يمكن إيجاد لها حلّ ولكن الخطأ في دخول أيّ حرب كان هو خراب للبنان وللجميع ، يا ليت الجميع يرى في الأفق البعيد ولا يحجمّ الأمور أكثر من ما هي عليه. فحتى الآن سمعت 5 قصص لحادث 7 من تشرين الأول 2009

[Red Phoenix]

Originally Posted by The Jade

The real problem ya Lebanesegirl is that as much as you're gonna say things loud and clear.

It will have to pass by many steps before getting to the right EAR:

1) The hardcore blinded Aounists: These people will defend anything the FPM and Michel Aoun do. They will attack you with the harshest words and treat you like a traitor who has been paid by Saad Hariri

2) The hardcore Aounists: These guys are here to support the blind ones, they are smarter than the others, so they use them as a shield.

3) The over enthusiastic supporters: These people see the mistakes from time to time but refuse to talk about them since "GMA knows best". They talk about a small mishap here and there, but the moment Michel Aoun goes on TV to tell them that what he did was right, they start to balance between this phase and the hardcore Aounist one.

4) The FPM supporters: Now there are many of this kind but very few who have the courage to stand up when something goes wrong and even fewer who would get it to the right EAR

5) Michel Aoun's garde rapprochée: Now these are the real danger. These people think that by screening the information they would be helping the leader, whereas they would be manipulating the info depending on their benefits.


So, all in all, if you manage to pass by these 5 phases (which would take a huge amount of effort, will and endurance) you'll still have to get past "THE EAR".

And the latter is no other than Michel Aoun because unfortunately the party is all about him. He can sack you and he can make you a king.

So, still wondering why the FPM is a huge machine that is having problems to take-off ?

hehe, i see u have given this ladder list a lot of forethought

but let me also wager another guess

u'r still stuck getting through the first step hehe

[hannaalsayssa]

Originally Posted by Bala Habal

X,

Don't you think that emotional reaction is a bit racist, meaning that it sees all Shiites as being one and the same as the killer?

(We protected them in 2006. They are killing us in 2009.)

Would the reaction be the same if it were another Christian (a LFer, say) who committed the crime?

That said, there can be no excuse for the Lebanese authorities not to arrest and try the murderer, regardless of his/her sect or the victim's.

a point can be made that

due to the relentless attack we are recieving and the MOU
our allies need to be very careful on that subject.
although HA is acting very carefully mr berri is just behaving as if he does not care.
thus the feeling some people are having, like we are under attack from our church to the west to the whole world
and an importnat fcator in shia ( amal) is just non challent.

the day will come when we will not be able to keep the alliance, it THAT WAS berri really wants?

so it is not a matter of racism in here, but let amal be a bit MORE PR SAVYY.