Open message to all fellow free activists!

[Comrade Bassam]

Originally Posted by Red Phoenix

so how does the active critics here propose to fix the probs their eyes and minds picked up ?

The answer to this is the very first sentence in the very first post in this thread...

[Shuyu3i]

Originally Posted by Comrade Bassam

People? and what makes you eligible to speak in the name of people?
And if there are still any human beings that still did not understand this issue, we have many excellent mental rehabilitation centers that can take care of their understanding capabilities.

I do not speak in the name of the people these so called 'leaders' do. If the 'people' did not think this then they would have voted for FPM majority in the elections. If we want to just hide behind our tail then thats fine.

[Shuyu3i]

Originally Posted by Comrade Bassam

Wrong! FPM is a living database of hundreds of top leaders, not on paper or positions, but in character and effectiveness.
And the occurrence of internal elections in the party has nothing to do with the leadership thing. There's nothing called "leader" in the party's organizational structure. So I advise you to do some research in that regard before making such a judgment.


How is that? Name me one single corrupt person that a court called for accountability and FPM interfered to protect him (or her).
Bass ba2a la22 7akeh bala ta3meh!



Wrong! This is not the way it happened. The questioning was upon doubts in bad intentions behind sending the poor guy to a hot region while they know the circumstances of it, without any prior coordination. The intentions were to create such an incident to strike upon Hezballah's and FPM's vision.



It's not FPM that needs to get back to a certain behavior. It's up to FPMers to rebuild their active spirits in society, and this is exactly the purpose of this thread.


So all the flaws you have cited are not accurate. Ghayro!

The flaws that I have cited are valid and if you don't see that then thats ur problem.

1st FPM ofcourse has one leader which is GMA. After GMA who will take over? Does anyone know? No they don't. Don't talk to me about political structure which the FPM itself looks like is not following. There was supposed to be elections like 2 years ago and nothing until now which means there is something not right with the party.

2nd, GMA saying that what was the pilot doing there is supporting our army? The LAF needs no coordination. It can do what it pleases when it please in any area. We shouldn't need POLITICAL COVERS for the army to operate in ANY region.

And as I said the FPM of 2005 is different than 2009. Maybe because our country is sectarian it has to go with the flow, not sure.

[Red Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Comrade Bassam

The answer to this is the very first sentence in the very first post in this thread...

i cant say i was convinced

all u can do is start another party/ies since u wont have a say in this current orange party from the current looks of things

hey i dont want to meddle in internal partisan business, but i'm just saying i'm not convinced on how some of u guys plan to reform fpm as a party

u can go back to becoming activists and go back to ur root ideas but how will that affect the party i am not so confident

this is lebanon in the end, we always had reformers but we always had more deaf ppl

honestly, aoun and fpmers worked their **** and heart out to get the syrians to leave but in the end if it was not for the american agenda and someone blowing up haririri, most lebanese wouldnt have listened

they only wanted syria out when the tv stations and clergies and embassies told them so

as i said, this is lebanon, so i'm curious how u plan to re-reform fpm as a party when from all accounts many fpm partisans are not the grade A type and when gma doesnt really approach this matter the way some of u guys would like and when the lebanese support base are morons at best and we all know that

it's just a question

in the end i'm more curious here than under the obligation to take sides or come up with a solution that i can't find now

i wont be sad if there is a good solution and answer

but i'm not keeping my hopes up either

i understand the social reformist background of many fpmers and that was the reason to be honest that i originally found my idealistic notions bringing me closer to fpmers. but realistically one needs to add pragmatism to that at some point. one shouldnt stop pushing for change, but it doesnt mean one will succeed immediatly b4 the conditions come to bloom at some point.

let me tell u a little story, i thought fpmers we actually more civilized than LFers are least when it came to internal elections

then we had a little test run fun election here on the forum and many many fpmers approached that little event in the same mentally LFers would have in lack of sportsmanship (negative ad campaigns galore, a claim to a right to win and authenticy, and overt and covert no-fun hostility to rouse up support)

so in essence, that is one more sample for ur eyesight to understand (but not accept) the current status of the party

for me, half the 'fpm is a slab of concrete now prob' is gma himself and the other half is most fpmers

the source of life here is also the source of its energy draining

i only wish cool fpm reformers luck on their one million step journey ;)

i'm just still happy that since i was born til now i never wanted nor liked to join any lebanese 'group', be it a club in school to a big political party

lebanese just dont function well together as is evident by all the bs jealousy and bickering we all have in our dayjobs in lebanese companies also

team players we lebanese are not although we always had a few stray prophet reformers

[Shuyu3i]

btw this is the charter. Tell me 1 thing that FPM is now talking about in 2009.

In Principles
The FPM declares:

1. Its belief that the individual is intrinsically valuable and that people are born equal and die equal, having equal rights, freedom, and dignity, and being able to differ in opinions, orientations and beliefs.

2. Its commitment to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and to all pertinent international charters and conventions, whose values and principles will act as guidelines to the Party’s goals and programs.

3. Its intransigence in the belief that Lebanon is a sovereign, free and independent entity founded on a social pact sanctioned by the free will of its people.

4. Its assertion that Lebanon is a distinctive human experience by virtue of its pluralism, intellectual interaction and openness to civilizations, and due to its pioneering democratic experience in the Arab world.

5. Its abidance by the Lebanese Constitution as a charter of governance in Lebanon, in its practice, interpretation, and ratification.

6. Its adherence to the openness of Lebanon to and its interaction with its Arab surroundings and the world, in such a way as not to conflict with the national belonging and provided that the Lebanese will be a dimension of Lebanon in foreign countries and not a foreign dimension within Lebanon.

7. Its conviction that men and women are equal in rights and obligations, since women are fundamental partners in the building of the society and in the making of the political decision.

In the Goals
The FPM aspires to:

1. Guaranty the sovereignty of the Lebanese state and its independence and to safeguard its existence.

2. Build a nation of law based on equality, justice, social solidarity, equal opportunities and the upholding of a fair judicial system, since the latter is a true and impartial criterion for the consolidation of justice and democracy.

3. Establish democracy as a system of government and a way of life by guaranteeing the respect of freedoms and basic rights of the citizen.

4. Institute a culture of citizenship in the aim of achieving equality between the Lebanese; enact a discretionary civil personal status law; and separate politics from religion to facilitate the establishment of a secular state.

5. Protect the family because it is the nucleus in the building of a society and a nation.

6. Eliminate all legal and social distinctions between men and women and promote equality through practice on the basis of competence and aptitude.

7. Persevere in supporting the youth and promote their role in developing the society and in stimulating political life.

8. Enable the Lebanese Diaspora to exercise their political rights in Lebanon from their countries of expansion and strengthen the bond among them and between them and their motherland.

9. Disseminate a political culture that liberates the Lebanese from a mentality of tutelage and supplication and develop their sense of critique.

10. Adhere to the free economic system and personal initiative within the boundaries of human dignity and the welfare and principles of social justice.

11. Promote institutional functions on the basis of competence and the implementation of the principal of liability and accountability.

12. Protect and Preserve the environmental resources for a healthy environment is a natural and intrinsic human right and a part of human existence.

13. Make education available to all Lebanese, propagate Lebanese heritage, develop all sectors and encourage the mastering of skills, sciences and arts in such a way as to cater to the needs of the society and the requirements of the age.

14. Propagate the culture of peace, dialogue and democracy.

It has turned itself to one of the sectarian parties that we have in lebanon sorry to say.

[Placebo]

we should create a reformist Movement within FPM. only this can help us. and i think the Orange room is the best place to start it. Most of the good activists are here. I don't know about some of the administrators, bass enno mainly we can start something substantial.

[The Jade]

Originally Posted by Comrade Bassam

Wrong! FPM is a living database of hundreds of top leaders, not on paper or positions, but in character and effectiveness.
And the occurrence of internal elections in the party has nothing to do with the leadership thing. There's nothing called "leader" in the party's organizational structure. So I advise you to do some research in that regard before making such a judgment.

FPM may be a living database, but it's offline.

That's its problem, it has countless good people in it, but any action taken by them that might not suit the leader (and yes FPM has a leader, since it didn't take yet the real structure it was intended to....but you know the leader will be replaced by the president who has considerable power in FPM's structure)
will be completely void if the latter decided not to go through with it.

The FPM is a living database and it didn't find anyone better than Tony Nasrallah or Nassif Azzi to put them in charge of communications ?????
You do realize that the FPM is the worst in this field and still these names are part of the higher committee not some local one in Hezzerta.

How is that? Name me one single corrupt person that a court called for accountability and FPM interfered to protect him (or her).
Bass ba2a la22 7akeh bala ta3meh!

You see, the problem isn't here.

The FPM doesn't have a problem accusing people of corruption.
It doesn't have a problem calling Hariri, Siniora and some of their allies corrupt.

YET, no court of law has ever accused them of anything.

The thing is, I don't blame them for doing so, our judicial system is so corrupt that none of the real corrupt people will get the axe.
BUT, if it wants to accuse people of corruption, let it at least include everyone: from Sleiman Frangieh to Nabih Berry, passing by Wahhab and other little scums.

Wrong! This is not the way it happened. The questioning was upon doubts in bad intentions behind sending the poor guy to a hot region while they know the circumstances of it, without any prior coordination. The intentions were to create such an incident to strike upon Hezballah's and FPM's vision.

Bad intentions or not, since when the army has to coordinate with anyone to go anywhere in Lebanon ?

Ok Hezbollah has proven that its weapons are legitimate BUT firing those weapons is illegal until the order is given by the state.

Ba3den, the other disgusting thing was when Hassan Nasrallah went on TV and said that the Hezb will NOT hand over anyone who doesn't want to be handed over.
And NO FPM LEADER had the guts to tell him that he was wrong.

The problem is not with Hezbollah carrying arms, it's with FPM shutting its mouth too many times !

It's not FPM that needs to get back to a certain behavior. It's up to FPMers to rebuild their active spirits in society, and this is exactly the purpose of this thread.

The FPM is made of FPMers.

BUT, what you need to realize is that in case you wanna start building a country it's NEVER with a movement that you will do.
It's with a structured party, with rules, actions, hierarchy, etc.

So all the flaws you have cited are not accurate. Ghayro!

Flaws are indeed accurate in case you wanna see it.


The problem is that, we've been warning about this for months now.
And you know what answer we got ?

GMA KNOWS BEST
You are paid by Saad Hariri
You are a traitor to your country
You're a filthy LFer

Up until next week, we've been trying to show FPM's flaws and problems.

Some of them are cited in your posts, others aren't.

Each and every time we criticized it and proposed a solution we were shut down, we were treated as scum and sometimes we were also banned from the forum.

You wanna revive the flame ??
So be it, it's very ambitious, but the problem here is that, upon Michel Aoun's first order, most of the people in this mini-revolution will come back to chanting Taratatata General !

My solution ?

Change has to come from a strong stand by one and only person: Michel Aoun.
Until the guy makes a move, decides to reorganize his party (like he promised right after the elections) the FPM will remain corrupted and comatose.

Change can come from the base IF the latter had a word, since it doesn't (since noone is held accountable in this party) you're gonna have to hope Michel Aoun gives the order to either organize this farm OR give the power to you guys :)

[Comrade Bassam]

Originally Posted by Red Phoenix

all u can do is start another party/ies since u wont have a say in this current orange party from the current looks of things

I have a very high "say" in the current orange party... Much more than you imagine!

u can go back to becoming activists and go back to ur root ideas but how will that affect the party i am not so confident

That's our nature regardless what it affects or what it doesn't.

this is lebanon in the end, we always had reformers but we always had more deaf ppl

We are Lebanon and this not us!

honestly, aoun and fpmers worked their **** and heart out to get the syrians to leave but in the end if it was not for the american agenda and someone blowing up haririri, most lebanese wouldnt have listened

They had listened already way earlier...

they only wanted syria out when the tv stations and clergies and embassies told them so

Any proof they didn't want them out? Because all the statistics I have from that period (much before the killing of Hariri) say otherwise.

let me tell u a little story, i thought fpmers we actually more civilized than LFers are least when it came to internal elections

then we had a little test run fun election here on the forum and many many fpmers approached that little event in the same mentally LFers would have in lack of sportsmanship (negative ad campaigns galore, a claim to a right to win and authenticy, and overt and covert no-fun hostility to rouse up support)

so in essence, that is one more sample for ur eyesight to understand (but not accept) the current status of the party

Agree... This is a cultural side of our Lebanese character that we need to fix. FPMers must educate themselves in those matters so they become again the examples in society.

[Comrade Bassam]

Originally Posted by Shuyu3i

The flaws that I have cited are valid and if you don't see that then thats ur problem.

Issue is that I proved you wrong...

1st FPM of course has one leader which is GMA.

FPM is a school in leadership. That's a fact.

After GMA who will take over?

There's nothing such as "take over" in FPM.

There was supposed to be elections like 2 years ago and nothing until now which means there is something not right with the party.

Not necessarily. I myself for example am against democracy as a partisan system and worked hard against it. So it's a matter of opinion after all.

2nd, GMA saying that what was the pilot doing there is supporting our army? The LAF needs no coordination. It can do what it pleases when it please in any area. We shouldn't need POLITICAL COVERS for the army to operate in ANY region.

The issue was a conspiracy. Period!

And as I said the FPM of 2005 is different than 2009. Maybe because our country is sectarian it has to go with the flow, not sure.

When all FPMers stop going with the flow, it would subsequently mean that FPM is not going with it but rather an independent flow by itself!

[Comrade Bassam]

Originally Posted by The Jade

The problem is that, we've been warning about this for months now.
And you know what answer we got ?

GMA KNOWS BEST
You are paid by Saad Hariri
You are a traitor to your country
You're a filthy LFer
Up until next week, we've been trying to show FPM's flaws and problems.

Some of them are cited in your posts, others aren't.

Each and every time we criticized it and proposed a solution we were shut down, we were treated as scum and sometimes we were also banned from the forum.

Some even dared to do worse with me... Yet I had my ways to break the barriers and impose. Those threads will keep opening every other day for constructive discussion on how to re-engineer our spirits! Whenever anybody shuts you up (if you don't deserve it indeed), find your ways to break your barriers as well...

You wanna revive the flame ??
So be it, it's very ambitious, but the problem here is that, upon Michel Aoun's first order, most of the people in this mini-revolution will come back to chanting Taratatata General !

That's my wish!

Change has to come from a strong stand by one and only person: Michel Aoun.
Until the guy makes a move, decides to reorganize his party (like he promised right after the elections) the FPM will remain corrupted and comatose.

The party is ours. GMA is doing a more than perfect job. This man is a living saint. The ball is in our court to make of ourselves (and thus of our movement) a successful one.

Change can come from the base IF the latter had a word, since it doesn't (since noone is held accountable in this party) you're gonna have to hope Michel Aoun gives the order to either organize this farm OR give the power to you guys :)

Don't you have control over your own self? Chou hal khabriyyeh hay???
You have a lot of misconception in both Aoun and Aounism!