Lebanon needs new political parties

[xcoder]

The sure thing is that we need a secular party who can face sectarianism especially after FPM adopted the sectarian speech.

[Fedayi]

Originally Posted by xcoder

The sure thing is that we need a secular party who can face sectarianism especially after FPM adopted the sectarian speech.

You're very right.But what about the za3ims of the Lebanese "parties" ?
What do you think about the fact that they will always remain the leaders of their parties until their death or their children will continue their paths ?
In Europe ,in Israel and in all Democratic countries political parties elect their president ,unlike in Lebanon ! What do you think about this (political feudalism)?
Don't you think that this issue is as dangerous as the sectarianism issue?

[Zayn]

Originally Posted by Fedayi

The 3 Armenian parties are laic parties(religion away from politics) .They are Armenian national parties ,which means that wherever there are Armenians in any part of the world there are these parties.And coincidently in Lebanon the Armenians are categorized in 3 sects (Armenian apostolic,Armenian Catholic,Armenian Evangelist).
For example (let's say)an Armenian catholic can be the president of Ramgavar party ,but a Sunii Muslim can't be a leader in Amal or Hezballa ,for example.
Therefore ,only in Lebanon these parties can be categorized as sectarian parties ,because the Armenians are a part of the Armenian Diaspora.
Anyways ,this issue is out of the thread topic.

The dynamics of the Muslims and those of the Armenians are very different. The Muslims of Lebanon are indigenous to the land, Armenians are not and constitute a very small minority. You guys need to stick together in order to make your voices heard--the Muslims do not.

So, in essence, an Armenian party is as sectarian as anybody else.

[Fedayi]

Originally Posted by Zayn

The dynamics of the Muslims and those of the Armenians are very different. The Muslims of Lebanon are indigenous to the land, Armenians are not and constitute a very small minority. You guys need to stick together in order to make your voices heard--the Muslims do not.

So, in essence, an Armenian party is as sectarian as anybody else.

As an Armenian ,I can say that in order to stick together as a one Armenian unit here in Lebanon ,we have to be categorized as a sectarian group.But in fact we are against religion getting into politics ,and we don't differenciate between Armenian apostolic or catholic or evangelist .Thus ARF( "Tashnag party") unites all Armenians and it's a socialist,democratic,national party .
Anyways ,the point of my thread is not sectarianism ,it's the political feudalism.
Why can not the Lebanese stop following these old feudal families?
Why they follow a za3im like he's God ?
They must follow an ideology not a human being .
I'm saying that SSNP and the communist party are well examples of democratic parties ,that change their leaderships over time .

[xcoder]

Originally Posted by Fedayi

You're very right.But what about the za3ims of the Lebanese "parties" ?
What do you think about the fact that they will always remain the leaders of their parties until their death or their children will continue their paths ?
In Europe ,in Israel and in all Democratic countries political parties elect their president ,unlike in Lebanon ! What do you think about this (political feudalism)?
Don't you think that this issue is as dangerous as the sectarianism issue?

Of course they are, but you should see them as a result of sectarianism and not at the same level. In Lebanon most parties use sectarianism to keep their places and people support whatever they do.
The proof is that there's no feudal non sectarian parties.

FPM chances of leading a real secular front against the sectarian one in Lebanon still exist and can have a big support, many FPMers like myself are waiting the FPM internal elections that will have place after the general elections and make FPM image clear regarding many matters especially secularism and feudalism and show a new real secular and democratic model.

[Armenian]

Originally Posted by J.Hanna

Armenian Party not sectarian lol..that must be a joke, or your probably Armenian so that might explain it..

- One of my reponsibles in the party in Lebanon was NOT Armenian...
- The leader of the Tashnag Party in Iraq, couple of years ago, was not Armenian and not even christian...

Any one adopting the By-Law and accepting the principles and ideology can become a member of Tashnag Party.

If you read the by law from A to Z you will not find one link between religion and the Party.

This is not a joke btw its a fact... I know that truth hurts but it's ok...

Thank you!!

[mickey117]

The Armenian parties are not sectarian they are ethnic parties....


We don't need new parties, we need the current parties to actually practice their ideologies, on the political spectrum we would then have something like this:

LF&Kataeb (Far-right) FM (right) FPM (center-right) HA&AMAL (center and/or islamic) Marada (center-left) SSNP (liberal left) PSP (left) LCP(Far left)

as for the armenian parties I think they would be:

Tashnag (left)
Hunshak (left)
Ramgavar (center-right)
FLAM (right)
Spartak (Old armenian fraction of LCP, so far-left)

[Secular Lebanon]

Originally Posted by mickey117

The Armenian parties are not sectarian they are ethnic parties....


We don't need new parties, we need the current parties to actually practice their ideologies, on the political spectrum we would then have something like this:

LF&Kataeb (Far-right) FM (right) FPM (center-right) HA&AMAL (center and/or islamic) Marada (center-left) SSNP (liberal left) PSP (left) LCP(Far left)

as for the armenian parties I think they would be:

Tashnag (left)
Hunshak (left)
Ramgavar (center-right)
FLAM (right)
Spartak (Old armenian fraction of LCP, so far-left)

I agree on the first part, but a few questions :

-what about marada makes you think it is left, or even center-left ?

- what about SSNP is liberal left ? I would have said authoritarian right, the exact opposite

+ what's with the Emile Rahme avatar ? Is it a joke or r u really a fan of this guy ?

[lebnan_lilkel]

I don't know why we are discussing a new party.

FPM has all the trademarks and aspirations of Many Lebanese.

They may have a strong Christian prescence but the unfair Hariri / Saudi Sunni strategy demonised many Lebanese groups and many other parties.

To change this, we have to defeat Hariristan and start discussing a secular state with all the Lebanese groups. We might not achieve it in the next decade, but we can certainly set the road.

[mickey117]

Originally Posted by Secular Lebanon

I agree on the first part, but a few questions :

-what about marada makes you think it is left, or even center-left ?

- what about SSNP is liberal left ? I would have said authoritarian right, the exact opposite

+ what's with the Emile Rahme avatar ? Is it a joke or r u really a fan of this guy ?

1- If you take Marada's principles, you can define it in one sentence, They believe in an Arab lebanon cooperating with the rest of the Arab countries and that Maronites are the most Arab of all. You can call it "Christian Arabism" if you want. So them technically being center, being arabist makes them lean to the left... However, el center kello byeshbah ba3do and there isin't really a clear manifestation of wether a party is center-right or center-left!


2- SSNP are on the left even the far-left in all the issues except the economic one where they are a lot more liberal, there somewhat social-democratic... 2ossotoon b3a2deh shwey, they are more to the left than center-left but not as left as the socialists....

3- noss hek noss hek, it's kind of a joke and I like the guy in the same time :P