Lebanese Detainees in Syria

[Greg Davis]

Originally Posted by L'arbalette

Dude, FPM and GMA and THE ONLY ONES WORKING ON THIS FILE... so go put your pressure on the government, the Patriarch, the LF etc... weren't these the guys who sent most of them there in the first place (the Patriarch, the LF, WJ, E Hraoui, and all the backers of October 13th)

Is that so............

When was the last time these detainees were mentioned by an FPM official?
It has been almost 3 years since the last parliamentary elections.
What measures have the FPM MP's taken in parliament or presented to cabinet in this regards.

I agree that the FPM did at one stage consider the detainees a priority, but what happened?

They worked on the file when communications with the Syrian regime were broken, and results were unachievable.

Now the relationship has improved, the issue has dissapeared.

Rhetorical to say the least.

Too much huff, and no blow.................

[L'arbalette]

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

Is that so............

When was the last time these detainees were mentioned by an FPM official?
It has been almost 3 years since the last parliamentary elections.
What measures have the FPM MP's taken in parliament or presented to cabinet in this regards.

I agree that the FPM did at one stage consider the detainees a priority, but what happened?

They worked on the file when communications with the Syrian regime were broken, and results were unachievable.

Now the relationship has improved, the issue has dissapeared.

Rhetorical to say the least.

Too much huff, and no blow.................

Two suggestions for you if your concern is genuine and not like that of the LF (who actually were drinking champagne and shelling the army positions when the Syrians killed and kidnapped them)

1) Go ask Solide who is supporting them

2) Do public awareness campaign in Australia... I'll be the first one to support you...

Otherwise, you're just a hypocrite trying to use every topic to attack FPM

[TripolySunni]

Kamal Fayyad said that most of the detainees were killed by jumblat and not in syrian prisons

[drinkaholic]

Originally Posted by Syrian Regime

لأ بالعكس حقوا لنظامي يعتقلون اذا كانو برأيو مجرمين او جواسيس لأنو نظامي كان منتدب من قبلكون يا صاحبي ليوقف الحرب الاهلية و هيك حرب مجنونة ما بتخلص بياعيني و يا روحي و العنف مطلوب ببعض الأوقات ولو أدى ذلك انو يروح الصالح مع الطالح
و ما عم بدعي انو كلن مذنبين لأ بالعكس ممكن يكون في منن أبرياء بس هاد حال الحروب بكل العصور في أبرياء بيدفعوا
التمن
وكمان ما بنكر أنو صارت بعض التجاوزات بعد الحرب
هلأ الخلاصة نحنا ما عنا اسرى لبنانين والأسرى يللي عنا رجعنالكن ياهن
يعيني بالأصل لو ما بدنا نفرج عنن ما كنا رجعنا يللي مسجوننين خلال الست سنين الماضية و يللي كنا فيها بأوج نفوذنا

كيف هالحكي يا صديق؟
هودي ال 200 اسم مش حقيقيين؟
هودي سجناء لبنانيين خطفتهن الحكومة السورية من دون حق, و في كتير من المسجونين صرلن 30 سنة محبوسين!و الدليل هي منظمة سوليدا و أهالي كل السجناء الذين هم من مختلف الطوائف و الأحزاب
كلا, حكومة آل الأسد ليس لديها الحق أن تعتقل هؤلاء الناس و واجب عى الحكومة السورية أن تطلق سراحهم لأن اعتقالهم لهذه المدة الطويلة في ظروف غير انسانية و وجود النعذيب هو أمر لا نستطيع ان نتقبله...

هؤلاء ابرياء و لا تنسى خاصة الجنود اللبنانيين ,الذين كانوا فقط يدافعون عن وطنهم و لا يعتدون على أحد, التي خطفتهم الحكومة السورية في 13 أكتوبر 1990

!سلام

[Greg Davis]

Originally Posted by L'arbalette

Two suggestions for you if your concern is genuine and not like that of the LF (who actually were drinking champagne and shelling the army positions when the Syrians killed and kidnapped them)

1) Go ask Solide who is supporting them

2) Do public awareness campaign in Australia... I'll be the first one to support you...

Otherwise, you're just a hypocrite trying to use every topic to attack FPM

The only way the FPM can effectively support Solide is by getting them answers.
As to public awareness, what the hell good will making the Australian public aware of the Syrian regime's autrocities in Lebanon. Australia has no trade, tourism or military ties with Syria.
A campaigne here is as useless as fighting for the detainees freedom while at loggerheads with their captures.

If questioning a political party's direction, that has deviated from the mandate it's representatives were elected upon makes me a hypocrite, I applaud you.

[Diabolo_7]

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

There was a time when "Lebanese Detainees in Syria" was a priority topic on the FPM forum.
It appears as though the Forum has evolved to a point to which this topic has become redundant .
As a matter of principle, I am reviving this topic because a topic of this magnitude shouldn't be swept under the rug in archives.

Below is a list of Lebanese deemed to be detained in the Syrian Prisons:
Maybe the FPM relations with the Syrian regime has improved to a point to which answers can be given, and if not, why has the FPM gotten complacent?

Greg Davis

talk is cheap! where were you in this thread SOLIDE sit-in 3rd year anniversary

You only show your face to score a cheap political point against FPM.

What have you dont lately to the issue of those prisoners? Did you do something that FPM hasnt done?

Cheers

[Diabolo_7]

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

Is that so............

When was the last time these detainees were mentioned by an FPM official?
It has been almost 3 years since the last parliamentary elections.
What measures have the FPM MP's taken in parliament or presented to cabinet in this regards.

I agree that the FPM did at one stage consider the detainees a priority, but what happened?

They worked on the file when communications with the Syrian regime were broken, and results were unachievable.

Now the relationship has improved, the issue has dissapeared.

Rhetorical to say the least.

Too much huff, and no blow.................

Dude

There are not relations between FPM and the Syrian regime.

You might want to ask President Sleiman about the issue, he is the one that has Bashar's phone number

Cheers

[L'arbalette]

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

If questioning a political party's direction, that has deviated from the mandate it's representatives were elected upon makes me a hypocrite, I applaud you.

Of course not... however, maliciously using a topic one has absolutely no interest in or resolve to support by one's own means (as proven by your un-willingness to do anything about it) just to try to discredit a political opponent is, in my opinion (but of course, personne n'est infaillible), hypocritical...
Good Karl Rove type politics... however, on this forum, this topic is taken seriously and we don't like to cheaply use the suffering of the parents, friends and families of the detainees in Syria... One suggestion, spread your venom in Future TV, LBC or An-Nahar... you might even get some money out of it.... (2 birds in one stone: bad-mouthing FPM and getting some money, nice deal no?)

[TayyaRevolution]

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

Is that so............

When was the last time these detainees were mentioned by an FPM official?

........

Originally Posted by TAYYAR AL AOUNI

Feb 08, 2008:

Aoun: The [Lebanese] state should handle this issue with the [Syrian] state, and there should be an investigation about the issue of those kidnapped. This issue should be settled; those who were killed should be announced as dead, those who were kidnapped should be announced as kidnapped, and those who are imprisoned should return. This issue should have been resolved prior to the withdrawal of the Syrian regime.

....

Aoun: We don’t have any official capacity to solve the problem of the detainees in Syria.

Nasrallah: The government is responsible of the dossier of the detainees in Syria, for it had refused to establish a joint committee with the Syrians in this regard.

....

March 14, 2008:

Deputy Salim Salhab

Speaking for the FPM, Salhab insisted that neither Aoun nor the party had forgotten those left behind in Syria. “In our Memorandum of Understanding, we asked Hezbollah to mention the detainees in Syrian prisons as well as those in Israel,” he pointed out. He blamed the government of Fouad Siniora, and before him, the governments of Omar Karami and Rafik Hariri, for not securing the return of the prisoners from both Syria and Israel.

“Of course, I admit that there are certain problems and that there are many things that I haven’t forgiven Syria for. But, [the return of the prisoners] should happen in a state-state relationship and not separately, on an individual basis,” argued Salhab. The return of prisoners, the FPM believes, should be secured by negotiations after the Lebanese government has been reformed and relations between Syria and Lebanon have been normalized. “We didn’t forget, and there are a number of MPs following this up with the follow-up committee,” he said.

....

26 April 2008:

General Michel Aoun: ruling group waited until the Syrians had left to begin hostilities

Change and Reform bloc and Free Patriotic Movement leader MP General Michel Aoun spoke to Orange Television to mark the third anniversary of Syria's withdrawal from Lebanon.

He slammed the ruling group for waiting until the Syrians had left to begin hostilities and "declare war on Syria when it left Lebanon. Had they been brave they would have confronted Syria on Lebanese terrain."

"After Syrian withdrawal in April 2005, we were surprised that some Lebanese politicians were chasing the Syrians to Damascus and continuing to attack the Syrian regime," General Aoun said.

"It would have been much better had they opposed Syria during its presence in Lebanon. Back then, they used to describe the presence of Syrian forces in Lebanon as necessary, legitimate, and temporary."

"When I called for a war of liberation it was aimed at liberating Lebanon's land and I said that by achieving this goal the war would end."

"The goal has been achieved. So what is the reason for proceeding with the battle?" General Aoun asked.

"We have no interest but in building future relations, and we shouldn't be in collision with them. The relationship between the Lebanon and Syria should be neighbourly and brotherly," he stressed.

Regarding the fate of Lebanese prisoners in Syrian jails, Aoun said the Lebanese government was to blame for not finding a solution.

General Aoun said Fouad Siniora's Government "rejects calls to look for those missing in their land (buried in mass graves), that is why we cannot hold Syria responsible first" for the Lebanese missing in its jails.

"The government should find those buried in its land and the government is capable of doing this because there is no village that does not know the location of its mass grave and who is responsible for it, be they Palestinians or Lebanese militias. The government knows, the intelligence agencies know and many journalists know where the mass graves are," Aoun added.

He said a "minority" of those held in Syria had been held directly by the Syrian forces. The majority were either arrested by Lebanese police or held by pro-Syrian factions and turned on to the Syrians.

....

In addition, our continual support of S.O.L.I.D.E.

....

On a different side to the issue, you might also want to have a look at the following:

Originally Posted by TAYYAR AL AOUNI

http://forum.tayyar.org/749655-post1.html

http://forum.tayyar.org/749834-post2.html

http://www.marhabalubnan.org/23apr08/part5.ram

[vegojimbo]

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

Yes GMA and the FPM must work harder on this file, not to help/improve their image and to avert media attacks and propaganda, but to get answers and give closure to the detainee's loved ones, espescially to the soldiers who were under his command.

and how can FPM get answers when it has no good relations with Syria and bad ones with PSP and LF?

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

Is that so............

When was the last time these detainees were mentioned by an FPM official?
It has been almost 3 years since the last parliamentary elections.
What measures have the FPM MP's taken in parliament or presented to cabinet in this regards.

3 years? FPM cooperates with Solide on a daily basis, and celebrates 13 October each year. In 2006, a demo was launched under rain even for the memorial.
As for measures taken by parlement, what exactly did u have in mind? and how effective would they be if our own PM who promised to take care of this file in the Round table is neglecting it? Still I want to hear ur proposals about what FPM can bring to parlement that can effectively close the books on this ugly chapter in Lebanon's history.

I agree that the FPM did at one stage consider the detainees a priority, but what happened?

it's still a priority, or are we supposed to talk about it 24/7 on TVs in order for u to believe we still care about the detainees?

Now the relationship has improved, the issue has dissapeared.

how did FPM's relation with the syrian regime improve exactly?

Originally Posted by Greg Davis

The only way the FPM can effectively support Solide is by getting them answers.

and how would they do that?

Now to be more effective, how about u ask SG and WJ about the issue? They were participants in the 13 October event, and many officers and soldiers were finished by them even before they reached Damascus. Surely, they know the location of the grave sites, so let them help a bit.

If questioning a political party's direction, that has deviated from the mandate it's representatives were elected upon makes me a hypocrite, I applaud you.

so finally we come to the real reason behind u opening the thread. It was not done out of principle, rather just to state that FPM changed and turned back on all of its principles and causes, and that FPM is now a hypocrite.
The jig is up.