Identity issue

[J. Abizeid]

Originally Posted by SamerTayyar

can someone define Lebanon first? Does it actually exist or is it something you dream of achieving?

You are asking tough questions.
Parrots can talk and repeat what they hear. Asking them to think is not part of the deal…

[Venom]

My Pocket first...

[J. Abizeid]

Originally Posted by Venom

My Pocket first...

In America they call it "pocket book" They don’t like to carry cash.

[J. Abizeid]

Originally Posted by Abou Sandal

True...And I also think that “Federalism”, deep in their minds, is still, yet another way that seeks the full Elimination of others, under the false pretext/illusion of self-preservation.

I just looked it up:
“Federalism” means “Tawtin” in Arabic.

[elias-aj]

Originally Posted by Salome

Since there is a long way to go till a common national identity, lets start brainstorming now.

Who if not you in this forum would be capable for that?

So let's gather here the personal opinions on what can form the base of a common identity? What does it mean for you to be Lebanese? What does Lebanon mean for you? And also that what does Lebanon NOT mean for you, meaning as how you dont want it to be.

Lets see, can we at least move into the same direction?

As a first step, the values we share...

Liberty and freedom on a social (to some extent), political (to some extent too) and economical level. We're so fond of freedom that we almost turned our country into a jungle.

The consequences are huge as it implies our commitment to human rights, to the separation of powers and to a capitalist / liberal economical system.

Conviviality - when we're not at war.

The fact that - like it or not - we're as much part of the mediterranean / western world as part of the "arab" world. Even if many pretend to be part of only one of these two environments.

I guess the problem is that we rejected the duality of our identity - the "double negation".

That's some ideas I wanted to throw and which are of course debatable.

Just to conclude - by another "idea" -, I think one of the biggest obstacle for us is the current struggle between our will to modernize our society and our traditional heritage. A reflection of this struggle is the attempt of modernization led by the chehabist movement and stopped by our ottoman's style establishment who was slaming on the brakes.

Now do we have to accept the situation with fatalism ? I don't know honestly but I find it totally appaling that the current political debates just ignore the most crucial question that we're facing which is : do we all want to live together in a country called Lebanon ?

[elias-aj]

Originally Posted by SamerTayyar

can someone define Lebanon first? Does it actually exist or is it something you dream of achieving?

Lebanon is a country which exists and which has its particular nature, the problem being that the lebanese are in a way or another rejecting its existence and its particular nature hence rejecting their true identity.

[Salome]

Originally Posted by elias-aj

As a first step, the values we share...

Liberty and freedom on a social (to some extent), political (to some extent too) and economical level. We're so fond of freedom that we almost turned our country into a jungle.

The consequences are huge as it implies our commitment to human rights, to the separation of powers and to a capitalist / liberal economical system.

Conviviality - when we're not at war.

The fact that - like it or not - we're as much part of the mediterranean / western world as part of the "arab" world. Even if many pretend to be part of only one of these two environments.

I guess the problem is that we rejected the duality of our identity - the "double negation".

That's some ideas I wanted to throw and which are of course debatable.

Just to conclude - by another "idea" -, I think one of the biggest obstacle for us is the current struggle between our will to modernize our society and our traditional heritage. A reflection of this struggle is the attempt of modernization led by the chehabist movement and stopped by our ottoman's style establishment who was slaming on the brakes.

Now do we have to accept the situation with fatalism ? I don't know honestly but I find it totally appaling that the current political debates just ignore the most crucial question that we're facing which is : do we all want to live together in a country called Lebanon ?

Good question with the emphasis on together. In addition how one solves the question of this duality, western world and arabism? How can you mend these two into one identity?

[Salome]

geez Ashrafieh_LF, you voted for "Lebanon first" How come, can you explain?

[elias-aj]

Originally Posted by Salome

Good question with the emphasis on together. In addition how one solves the question of this duality, western world and arabism? How can you mend these two into one identity?

By taking the best of each "civilization" and not - as we're currently doing - taking the worst...

In fact, you don't really need to mend two identities into one identity... look at us, see how we live, see how we can generally adapt ourselves anywhere be it in the US or in the Emirates for example. We're anywhere at home. To some extent we live like the westerners do, think like them but we have typical mediterranean / oriental behaviours too.

Look at our country. Sometimes you feel as if you were in a western country and sometimes as if you were in a arab or oriental country, and often, as if you're in a place where those two cultures are merged into one culture. Here's an example : what's left from the typical lebanese architecture which is somewhat a mix between the renaissance style and the oriental style (Beit Ed Dine...).

Another thing is our geographic location : we're as much part of the mediterranean / western world as part of the arab world.

The real question is when are we going to accept it ? Then, the issue will be to define or precise this identity by taking the best of each culture and rejecting what must be rejected.

We'll be ready to accept it - christians, chiites, druzes and sunnis - once we accept to live together in an independant country. We'll accept to live together once confidence between the different communities is restored. And this confidence will be restored once we clean our past, work on our memory notably on the civil war events in order to forgive ourselves for what we've done... We have to stop this mass amnesia that we're organizing but the lebanese suffer from a lack of guts.

[Frisbeetarian]

What about the "neither" option?