Church in Lassa

[Venom]

Originally Posted by Bay Bayya

If the problem is over a religious building, then why weren't they keys handed to the Batrak?

بحسب "النهار"، ان العماد عون الذي تسلم المفتاح بالاتفاق مع المطران انطوان نبيل العنداري

wlak read!!!

It was agreed with the bishop.

[Youchka]

Originally Posted by chafic

So legally it is a settled matter but still it remained a matter of conflict?
In other words, it could either be the responsibility of the judicature, the ISF, or there was no problem to begin with.

Ok we will go in it bel malka3a metel ma bi oulo. Ken ya ma ken bi adim el zamen a piece of land on which there was a small mazar in which Christians would go pray. Bi hal zamen, some people came out and said that this land on which this mazar is built is actually not the church's ownership but theirs. Wa houna bada'a el khilaf (I guess the voice of Abd el majid majzoub would have been perfect here).

Ever since that zaman, the conflicts over this land were not over. The parties in conflict (the church and the Chiite cheikhs) were not able to settle their conflict. To this minute it remains unknown (hon bi fout el violin effect) if the church has filed a lawsuit (if that was the case akid akid tab3an tab3an kenna 3erfna), but seemingly it hasn't.

Now the issue is dealt with houbiyan, hamdella, when the law and the ISF and whoever could not actually settle it, someone came and did it peacefully, I am thankful to him, even if it my enemy. Now the people arounf the mazar can all live happily ever after and the issue is closed (hon bi fout el trompette ou el clarinette effect).

[fidelio]

Originally Posted by chafic

Let me get it straight fidelio. We're talking about 2 political parties, both of whom are significantly involved in the political life, whether in the parliament or in the government. Instead of working on reforming the judicial system, they absolve themselves from this responsibility and try to do the court's job.

Both political parties did not engage in a problem-solving process to undermine the judicial system, they did it out of urgency and to diffuse the growing sectarian rift that some people are planting in Jbeil, in and around Lassa.
That's a intricate fact to this issue and i would prefer the sober realist approach than the long idealistic one in issues of immediate urgency like this particular one.

Originally Posted by chafic

On the other hand fidelio, shall we adopt the same criteria for settling issues everywhere? Like give the right of conflict solving to dominant political parties?

Of course not, this is not textbook M.O. for solving land dispute and should not be adopted if any lawsuit was filed. But nothing of this sort happened here, thus the urgency and legitimacy of the way it was solved.

Originally Posted by chafic

What transpired from the media is too little to tell why it was necessary for 2 political parties to solve the issue, or how they actually did so.

I read fear mongering (something you abhor), and the issue was swiftly solved to put an end to that behavior. Mostly by LF and Kataeb. Soueid was also pretty busy.
Where's the harm in that? Or to ask the question differently, was the bigger harm curbed?

Originally Posted by chafic

They could very much be afraid, or that they prefer conceding rather than undermining their tribal leaders' legitimacy.

Oh, afraid. Too afraid to file a lawsuit?
And besides, if they ever want to file a lawsuit, what would that lawsuit be?

Originally Posted by chafic

What would have been a fair stance within what his prerogatives allow?

He could at least announce the urgency to expedite the lawsuits against media outlets such as Shiraa and Mustaqbal in the same way he did with NTV. There's libel and defamation in both cases.
Nothing odd in that?

Originally Posted by chafic

He's biased like most of the other ministers, but I'm more interested in an evaluation of his professional behavior, like as a minister.

Some, (if not all) ministers should not be biased. Especially when lady justice should not lose her virginity. If he's the gentleman he seems to be, maybe he should take her out of the harem.
It is not professional of him to be biased chafic, there's something to look at.

[Venom]

عضو المجلس السياسي في "حزب الله" غالب ابو زينب


- بشأن ما حصل في بلدة لاسا أمس، يبدو ان البعض اراد ان ينبش في الدفاتر العتيقة، لان هؤلاء لا يستطيعون ان يعيشوا أو يكبروا الا بالأذية، واذا قرأتم موقع "القوات اللبنانية" الإلكتروني تشعرون وكأنّ هناك حربا على لبنان وعلى العماد عون تحديداً.


- نحن اتفقنا مع "الجنرال" وقلنا له ان هذا الموضوع أصبح في عهدتك وانت الذي تقرر كيف تسيّر الامور، نحن اعطيناه المفتاح وهو قال انه يشعر بان هناك من يريد ان يدخل في هذا الموضوع.

- نحن ندعو هؤلاء، وعرفتُ ان احدهم دعا الى مؤتمر صحافي، بأن لا يتاجروا بمنطقة جبيل وبالعيش المشترك فيها، وأن لا يزجّوا اسم "حزب الله" بما حصل بالامس.

لا "التيار الوطني الحرّ" ولا "حزب الله" ولا الناس سيتاثرون بما جرى بالأمس و"القوات اللبنانية" تعرف ذلك، وهذا الامر لن يؤمّن لهم شعبية كبيرة كما لن يفكّ التحالف القائم بين "التيار" و"الحزب"، وهم من سيكونون الخاسرين في نهاية المطاف لان ما يحاولون القيام به ما هو الا "زوبعة في فنجان".

otv

[chafic]

Originally Posted by Youchka

Ok we will go in it bel malka3a metel ma bi oulo. Ken ya ma ken bi adim el zamen a piece of land on which there was a small mazar in which Christians would go pray. Bi hal zamen, some people came out and said that this land on which this mazar is built is actually not the church's ownership but theirs. Wa houna bada'a el khilaf (I guess the voice of Abd el majid majzoub would have been perfect here).

Ever since that zaman, the conflicts over this land were not over. The parties in conflict (the church and the Chiite cheikhs) were not able to settle their conflict. To this minute it remains unknown (hon bi fout el violin effect) if the church has filed a lawsuit (if that was the case akid akid tab3an tab3an kenna 3erfna), but seemingly it hasn't.

So basically an important part of your nice little story is missing. You didn't add much info, but I congratulate you for the narrative style.

Originally Posted by Youchka

Now the issue is dealt with houbiyan, hamdella, [b]when the law and the ISF and whoever could not actually settle it, [\b] someone came and did it peacefully, I am thankful to him, even if it my enemy. Now the people arounf the mazar can all live happily ever after and the issue is closed (hon bi fout el trompette ou el clarinette effect).

Why couldn't the law of the ISF settle it?

[Youchka]

Originally Posted by chafic

So basically an important part of your nice little story is missing. You didn't add much info, but I congratulate you for the narrative style.

Which part?

Why couldn't the law of the ISF settle it?

I dunno why you are asking me, go ask the ISF, what has they done about it. Now when you have the answer come back and break it to us.

[drinkaholic]

Hello!
My dad is from Lassa,and this is the first time I hear about Lassa in the news

I am really suprised at this issue,
unfortunately we rarely go to Lassa,so I have little knowledge about the atmosphere there and the current situation;
but I'm surprised,is there really tensions between the Christians and Muslims of Lessa? :-/ Or is this a media exaggeration? Does anyone know much about that area?

I always heard it was peaceful there after the civil war....

Thank you !

[Venom]

Originally Posted by drinkaholic

Hello!
My dad is from Lassa,and this is the first time I hear about Lassa in the news

I am really suprised at this issue,
unfortunately we rarely go to Lassa,so I have little knowledge about the atmosphere there and the current situation;
but I'm surprised,is there really tensions between the Christians and Muslims of Lessa? :-/ Or is this a media exaggeration? Does anyone know much about that area?

I always heard it was peaceful there after the civil war....

Thank you !

Hi drinkaholic!

If u r taking ur news from the Valentinos u will feel it is a war zone....eventually there was a dispute on a piece of land and it was solved and file closed.....

the exaggeration was only for electoral purposes....ye3neh shee ma 2elo ta3meh..LF know very well that ma 2elon khebez in Jbeil...and not only Jbeil.

[fidelio]

chafic, the ISF can't enforce without a court order, a court order can't be issued without a trial and a trial can't issue a verdict if there's no lawsuit filed to start with...
Basically, no one asked for the rule of court/state/dawle/nizam or whatever.

The maronite church is probably the most moral person with issues of land disputes with individuals and they rarely if not never ask for the rule of law.

[drinkaholic]

Originally Posted by Venom

Hi drinkaholic!

If u r taking ur news from the Valentinos u will feel it is a war zone....eventually there was a dispute on a piece of land and it was solved and file closed.....

the exaggeration was only for electoral purposes....ye3neh shee ma 2elo ta3meh..LF know very well that ma 2elon khebez in Jbeil...and not only Jbeil.

Hiii Venom,long time no see,thank you for your reply :-)

Yes I had read something about this issue maybe like 1 or 2 weeks ago on the LF,it was reported that the church was forcibly being turned into a mosque ?

And then yesterday it was posted that there was a death threat for someone (i think a Christian religious man ) and 2 bombs planted? (or were to be planted) so I was kind of shocked that it had reached to such a point when there were previously no trouble between the people of Lessa...It seemed as if the Muslims were attacking Christians,and I was surprised at that because we're not in the civil war for bombs and death threats to be sent between the townspeople :/ So I wanted to know if this was an exaggerated news

Churches and Mosques should be open to all people,I don't find a difference,they are all the houses of God and centers for faith afterall!

Salam