50 years passed by and still we did not get it

[Frisbeetarian]

Why dont you answer my question:

So why no one is asking for the disarmement of the Palestinians in Lebanon then?

Whats the point behind disarming the Palestinians?

This is why I think everything being said about Towtin is just a propaganda. Even most Sunnis do not accept Towtin. Nobody wants to work in the Gulf for the entire of his life. Plus, Towtin cannot happen if Shiites and Christians are against it.

I do not understand the reason behind this paranoia...They used to accuse Rafic Hariri of Towtin, then after his assassination, Israel and USA were to blame. I mean come on, I thought Israelis were working on Towtin, why killing Hariri then ?

You are mistaken. Tawtin is very real, and it is probably Israel's most thought after objective. Because in order to ensure its survivability in this land it must make sure that the Palestinians it annexed 60 years ago can never come back. That was the sole objective of the Zionists.

[GMA forever]

Originally Posted by IA64

This is why I think everything being said about Towtin is just a propaganda. Even most Sunnis do not accept Towtin. Nobody wants to work in the Gulf for the entire of his life. Plus, Towtin cannot happen if Shiites and Christians are against it.

I do not understand the reason behind this paranoia...They used to accuse Rafic Hariri of Towtin, then after his assassination, Israel and USA were to blame. I mean come on, I thought Israelis were working on Towtin, why killing Hariri then ?

You talk as if the Lebanese people have a say in this,

Did everyone support the cairo agreement?
Did everyone support the jerusalem road passing through jounieh?
Did everyone support syria invading Lebanon?
Did everyone support Israel's invasion?
Did everyone support selling Lebanon to Syria for return of support in Iraq?
Did everyone support Taef?

The answer you will say is surely NO, and although it is a NO, those things happened ghasseb 3an ra2bit a lot of Lebanese.

So the tawtin issue you should work on preventing it, because once it is on the table, you will only be able to accept it then.

[alabellez]

When was ever the "tawtin" a propaganda issue??!!!... I mean how can something very real (and a real threat to our lebanese "kayen" ) be a propaganda issue?!!
It won't happen any time soon, I agree, because we're against it as christians and shiites... But who garantees it won't happen in 4 years when saad has even more influence and power, and can do whatever he feels like doing?! When you say sunnis are against it, i think that's very wrrooonngg and that's the real propaganda!!!! We might have a short term memory as lebanese but there are things we will never forget! Plus where's the propaganda with the ones that already have the nationality?!
I mean come on it's not something we're paranoid (for no reason) of! Where's the birth place of sunni extremism?! In their camps!!! Ever heard of "nahr l bered" ??!
The main reason behind not giving us the right (as women) to transfer our nationality for our children is the fact they're scared of a tawtin "gher mubashar!!"
I mean come on when we don't have any real "damanet" against such an issue, we have every right to nag about it each and every single day (especially when we can't do anything other than nag about it!!!)...
To the ones saying it's not something real, It's very real! We're the only ones that hold the solution for the entire middle east problems! and it's very simple : give up this country for palestians to live in, give up every single form of power we have left for the sunnis to rule, and then leave!

[Anny]

Originally Posted by alabellez

When was ever the "tawtin" a propaganda issue??!!!... I mean how can something very real (and a real threat to our lebanese "kayen" ) be a propaganda issue?!!
It won't happen any time soon, I agree, because we're against it as christians and shiites... But who garantees it won't happen in 4 years when saad has even more influence and power, and can do whatever he feels like doing?! When you say sunnis are against it, i think that's very wrrooonngg and that's the real propaganda!!!! We might have a short term memory as lebanese but there are things we will never forget! Plus where's the propaganda with the ones that already have the nationality?!
I mean come on it's not something we're paranoid (for no reason) of! Where's the birth place of sunni extremism?! In their camps!!! Ever heard of "nahr l bered" ??!
The main reason behind not giving us the right (as women) to transfer our nationality for our children is the fact they're scared of a tawtin "gher mubashar!!"
I mean come on when we don't have any real "damanet" against such an issue, we have every right to nag about it each and every single day (especially when we can't do anything other than nag about it!!!)...
To the ones saying it's not something real, It's very real! We're the only ones that hold the solution for the entire middle east problems! and it's very simple : give up this country for palestians to live in, give up every single form of power we have left for the sunnis to rule, and then leave!

Well you and me are opposing that so lets work against them, you know lots of hippies put together have made it clear to the USA that they dont want to get involved in the war of Vietnam, so by that it didnt help for the USA to win that war, we can do something about all they project that they have for us by begining to act on that, if we stay pessimist that tawtin and just nag about it, it wont lead anywhere, we should step into the middle of it and refuse everything that they planed for us. The plus in this, we are not the only one, we do have support!

[IA64]

Originally Posted by GMA forever

You talk as if the Lebanese people have a say in this,

Did everyone support the cairo agreement?
Did everyone support the jerusalem road passing through jounieh?
Did everyone support syria invading Lebanon?
Did everyone support Israel's invasion?
Did everyone support selling Lebanon to Syria for return of support in Iraq?
Did everyone support Taef?

The answer you will say is surely NO, and although it is a NO, those things happened ghasseb 3an ra2bit a lot of Lebanese.

So the tawtin issue you should work on preventing it, because once it is on the table, you will only be able to accept it then.

Well, If it is going to happen, it is going to happen;

I feel sorry for how things end up in Lebanon but this is the truth.

War 75-76 brought nothing but disaster and the consequences were fatal. Yet, the Palestinians story does not end.

[Anny]

Originally Posted by IA64

Well, If it is going to happen, it is going to happen;

I feel sorry for how things end up in Lebanon but this is the truth.

War 75-76 brought nothing but disaster and the consequences were fatal. Yet, the Palestinians story does not end.

Even if you want tawtin, I refuse it and I and other like me wont let it happen, so keep dreamen. Palestinian story can end by ship them in somewhere else like Saudié or even back to Israel where they really belong, let the jews deal with their own problems not lebanese!

[Robin Hood]

The way I see it, unless we fight, we are going toward both Tawtin and Taksim.

1. SH naturalized Palestinians ---> Lebanon becomes a Sunni state.

2. SG requests and get's along with partitioning Lebanon ---> We get a Christian state with his as it's leader.

3. WJ does the same thing as SG ---> We get a Druze state with WJ as it's leader.

4. The Shias, left with no option, will have to declare their own state because we don't want to suffer like in other Arab countries ---> The American plan is implemented, an Arab country is devided ---> Israel wins.

[alabellez]

Originally Posted by Robin Hood

The way I see it, unless we fight, we are going toward both Tawtin and Taksim.

1. SH naturalized Palestinians ---> Lebanon becomes a Sunni state.

2. SG requests and get's along with partitioning Lebanon ---> We get a Christian state with his as it's leader.

3. WJ does the same thing as SG ---> We get a Druze state with WJ as it's leader.

4. The Shias, left with no option, will have to declare their own state because we don't want to suffer like in other Arab countries ---> The American plan is implemented, an Arab country is devided ---> Israel wins.

Wrong :D! once lebanon becomes a sunni state, either you agree with their decisions or you agree with their decisions! Not samir geagea or whatever christian leader will have a say in what happens in lebanon (they don't even have a say now!!! for them to have a say in the future is sci-fi! pure and simple)! our situation as lebanese christians will become similar to that of the christians in syria, egypt, jordan, and any other arab country... There will be no federal republic in lebanon! Not now not ever! As for shiites well once the palestians have the nationality it's either they go along with the sunnis as decision makers or we'll have another civil war and of course as all the wars in lebanon, somehow it begins with us christians or them against us... either way we're doomed :D!

Now we should stop thinking what's going to happen in some time in the future and try working on preventing it! I don't think any shiite or christian would agree on giving palestians the nationality (NOW), which is why now would be as good a time as any for us to make a law preventing such a thing from happening!

[hhhh23]

There is a very easy solution for the Palestinian problem which, once and for all, will finish it, but I wonder why no one is considering it : "El Mounasafe!".

Assume we have 600 000 Palestinian, we naturalize them all, but we register 300 000 as Maronite Christians and the remaining 300 000 as Sunni.

That would be a great solution, would keep the sectarian balance, and no one will oppose anymore.

P.S. Mouselase would also work, but is not necessary, the Shi3a can easily catch up in a couple of years

[Robin Hood]

Originally Posted by alabellez

Wrong :D! once lebanon becomes a sunni state, either you agree with their decisions or you agree with their decisions! Not samir geagea or whatever christian leader will have a say in what happens in lebanon (they don't even have a say now!!! for them to have a say in the future is sci-fi! pure and simple)! our situation as lebanese christians will become similar to that of the christians in syria, egypt, jordan, and any other arab country... There will be no federal republic in lebanon! Not now not ever! As for shiites well once the palestians have the nationality it's either they go along with the sunnis as decision makers or we'll have another civil war and of course as all the wars in lebanon, somehow it begins with us christians or them against us... either way we're doomed :D!

Now we should stop thinking what's going to happen in some time in the future and try working on preventing it! I don't think any shiite or christian would agree on giving palestians the nationality (NOW), which is why now would be as good a time as any for us to make a law preventing such a thing from happening!

Yes we should work on preventing this from happening, but we should e prepared in case it starts to become implemented. Maybe a lot of Christians will leave, and u dont have arms, bass ne7na we can, khalihoun lal FM yde2o bi 1.5 million people and bi HA.