14 Febs announce the war against GMA: Get Ready FPMers for the biggest Battle

[shadow1]

Originally Posted by Venom

When FPM is in power they can implement their program.

Since not one party could ever control power in Lebanon, it will be a much watered down program, assuming at all that it's implementable while considering All the factors that may impede whatever it is that it contains.

3 years so far of fighting and trying to islolate FPM and we engaged in this battle and won it by getting a fair electoral law, fair participation in the government and a bayan weezareh that reflects the MoU.

And now we are waiting to see the tangible results of these victories as in actually improving people's lives as opposed to making them just happy their favourite party scored some political points.

Why don't u question FM,PSP,LF....about their achievements when they were in power.

One could easily argue that they gave you a fair electoral law, and fair participation in government albeit so late when they didnt have to as they are the majority in a parliament that you guys had the key to its door. As for the MOU points being incorporated in the bayan wizari, what gurantees do you have that it too wont be a good mawdou3 Insha? They always are.

[Jorje]

Originally Posted by Venom

When FPM is in power they can implement their program.

3 years so far of fighting and trying to islolate FPM and we engaged in this battle and won it by getting a fair electoral law, fair participation in the government and a bayan weezareh that reflects the MoU.

Why don't u question FM,PSP,LF....about their achievements when they were in power.

FPM's "ideas" and direction changed from 2005 till now. I'll be looking forward for the new booklet (just in case there's one) to compare it to the old one and have a good laugh. When we're talking about FPM's transformation it's basically about:

- being almost solely concerned with the Christians (as opposed to a party that addresses all Lebanese "iza takalamtou ta2ifiyan, bla bla bla")
- going against their supposed democratic principles in favor of mou7asasa and the partition of the government between all major parties.
- HA's arms. No need to explain a lot on this one. In 2005, the arms were a violation of the Taef and needed to be addressed immediately in order for the government to have full authority. Today, the arms are a "right" for a "resistance" acting outside the authority of the government, and a guaranty against Palestinian naturalization, global warming and alien attacks.

Those are on the top of my head, but there are much more.

--

To answer Chafic, the only concern for FPM is to win the elections. That's all what matters. It doesn't matter who you're running with or what you're running on. The leadership is basically stinking, though there might be some hope in the base even if they blindly follow the leaders.

[Venom]

Originally Posted by chafic

Not true, once they become a political party, they can start implementing their program.

Again how to implement it if you are not in power?

So the slogans will be:
- Participating in getting to a "fair" electoral law?
- Fair participation? (implying a participation of "Christians")
- A government statement that reflects the MoU (in the sense of giving legitimacy to Hezbollah)?

That's for the part concerning the "past", what will you promise achieving in the future?

Wait till next year's elections and you will know. Your problem chafic is you keep a closed eye on the corruption and disasters done by the ruling majority in the last 3 years and you dare to question what FPM did from outside the governement!

[hoda25]

The say that next elections will change the destiny of lebanon bla bla is just electoral rethoric (even though we beleive it )
The disaster in lebanon for all the lebanese people is that we all care about how to keep our leaders setting on their golden chairs (msibeh iza byes2toh ) but we do not ask what have they done for us what has changed since the latest elections ...el mouhemm l kettleh tzed ma ten2ass ..

[shadow1]

Originally Posted by Jorje

FPM's "ideas" and direction changed from 2005 till now. I'll be looking forward for the new booklet (just in case there's one) to compare it to the old one and have a good laugh. When we're talking about FPM's transformation it's basically about:

- being almost solely concerned with the Christians (as opposed to a party that addresses all Lebanese "iza takalamtou ta2ifiyan, bla bla bla")
- going against their supposed democratic principles in favor of mou7asasa and the partition of the government between all major parties.
- HA's arms. No need to explain a lot on this one. In 2005, the arms were a violation of the Taef and needed to be addressed immediately in order for the government to have full authority. Today, the arms are a "right" for a "resistance" acting outside the authority of the government, and a guaranty against Palestinian naturalization, global warming and alien attacks.

Those are on the top of my head, but there are much more.

rien ne se cree, rien ne se perd, tout se transforme.

It might be just a case of discovering the un-implementability of its political charter and opted for the MOU instead. Political idealism for realistic pragmatism. The good thing is like you said, and I must admit sarcastically, we are all "looking forward to the new booklet".

[Venom]

Originally Posted by shadow1

Since not one party could ever control power in Lebanon, it will be a much watered down program, assuming at all that it's implementable while considering All the factors that may impede whatever it is that it contains..

Implementing their program doesn't mean taking over the country.

And now we are waiting to see the tangible results of these victories as in actually improving people's lives as opposed to making them just happy their favourite party scored some political points.

it's not about scoring points , it's about restoring some stolen rights. That's how Lebanon is formed.

One could easily argue that they gave you a fair electoral law, and fair participation in government albeit so late when they didnt have to as they are the majority in a parliament that you guys had the key to its door. As for the MOU points being incorporated in the bayan wizari, what gurantees do you have that it too wont be a good mawdou3 Insha? They always are.

First of all nobody gave anything. Everything was taken by force!

People stop critisizing on ' naweya' .... I don't see you coming and say good things when FPM does something right, u just wait for them to do something wrong or think that they will do something wrong... while not a single criticism to the failed majority.

[shadow1]

Originally Posted by Venom

it's not about scoring points , it's about restoring some stolen rights. That's how Lebanon is formed.

What you mean here is that those rights were stolen by other Lebanese. What does that tell you about the suitability of being co patriot to someone who wants to steal your right. To me that is the fundamental question.

First of all nobody gave anything. Everything was taken by force!

Again, try to question the fundamnetal basis of citizenship when force is the only means. It's like really holding a gun to someone's head to love you. We all know they will say yes but do they?

People stop critisizing on ' naweya' .... I don't see you coming and say good things when FPM does something right, u just wait for them to do something wrong or think that they will do something wrong... while not a single criticism to the failed majority.

3a'ad l ma7abbeh l3atab kbeer!

[coralie]

Chafic and jorje

allow me to ask the question reversed you were the rulling force for the past 3 years you had the majority ya latif w ya lataftaf what did yoiu offer to your country ? did you clean some establishements from corruption ? did you even tried to fix the rulling system by being open to all factions in this country ? did you give electricity , water , social services , economical changes to your citizens ? what was YOUR program if there was any to begin with and what is your program for the next elections , will also be empty promises, sick insulting propaganda and dirty money and tanket zeit like usual ? .

it is also easy to blame and to critisize FPM when your own partis or pro parties are totaly invalid and corrupt and were the rulling majority for the past 3 years (not to mention the past 15 years) . you should be asking your own people and hold them accountable wlak just for once act like real responsable citizens instead of attacking those who really are trying to make this country pass peacefully from one filthy level to a better clean one .

now back to the topic .

i have one thing to say to FPMers and only to FPMers and pro , we have to work hard never take things for granted , only hard work and good will , will pay back GENEROUSLY.

[chafic]

Originally Posted by Venom

Again how to implement it if you are not in power?

You know Venom, my problem is that there is this old picture that lingers there on the entrance of a friend's building, scratched faded forgotten and all but still standing since 2005; It's a picture of Michel Aoun, on an orange background on which it's written: أفاق جديدة في تاريخ الوطن , and on the other corner: الإصلاح والتغيير . Those two together, which reflect what FPM was preaching in 2005, mean much more than a simple change in a ministry, or a public institution, they mean a new way of dealing in politics, a way that doesn't invest on sectarianism, a way that doesn't compromise on principles, a way that refuses violence, a way that advocates liberalism, a way that accepts democracy, a way that understands citizenship, a way that sees the individual not the herd...
Those are the change and reform that were pledged....and not delivered.

Originally Posted by Venom

Wait till next year's elections and you will know.

I would conclude you have no idea so far about what will the titles of the "program" be.

Originally Posted by Venom

Your problem chafic is you keep a closed eye on the corruption and disasters done by the ruling majority in the last 3 years and you dare to question what FPM did from outside the governement!

Bingo.

[chafic]

Originally Posted by Jorje

To answer Chafic, the only concern for FPM is to win the elections. That's all what matters. It doesn't matter who you're running with or what you're running on. The leadership is basically stinking, though there might be some hope in the base even if they blindly follow the leaders.

There's no doubt about the party's concern Jorje. I was simply wondering under which titles would they (FPM's candidates) be convincing voters to vote for them.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Coralie, thumbs up.