How do you live outside Lebanon?

[JohnZ]

Originally Posted by WiseCookie

Shoo habibi u want to get into a heated debate ?Why not? There is no qouta on my type of visa since it's a student visa u smart alec .There are many young people who have applied and get denied That means u can only study and u cannot work, and other than that, not being elligible for a social security number without work Was this a surprise to you? I'm sure you knew that going into thisand other than the fact that u are always treated for suspicion of staying in the country illegaly.Probably a bit exaggerated I went to apply for a stupid driver's license and got question about how i wanted to ge a license and my visa ends at the end of July. It's called securityNow what do you have to say ?I will conclude below One more thing, no one referred to you, or even got close to talk to u. Are u rich my friend ?Compared to you, yes, probably Do you have millions ?No What kind of oppurtunities are u talking about ?The American Dream Life is the same everywhere,Not even close you work and earn a living, fullstop.

Fine, but not related to this argument

Your words were extreme in the original thread,"I hate it here". You are not the 1st Lebanese that came here to endure immigration or earn an education. I spend 1month a year in Lebanon for the last 10 years and I have only heard a couple of people who are positive about staying in Lebanon. Everyone wants to leave, not necessarily because they don't like Lebanon but because there is not enough opportunities there. YOU made it to the US, and, to get an education. That is a huge step, well done. You are following many Lebanese that did the same thing and have suffered and made sacrifices. Many of those guys are more successful than American born Lebanese. However, if you are going to complain now you are losing my respect. You are not the only one who has suffered racism or questioning here. What about in the 80's when all the American's knew about Lebanon was hijacking, kidnapping, war, ect. Try telling people you are Lebanese here then. Questioning at the DMV? SO what, you'll be fine.
Look around at all the Lebanese people you see here in CA (I assumed that becasue you mentioned Mexico). Look at the ones who came as students and are still here now in their 30 and 40's. Most are lliving good lives. Compare that to the lives their counterparts who are living in Leb.
You said it's the same everywhere, you work, earn a full living, full stop etc. I disagree. (You are still studying, not working) Yes, you can find a good job in Leb, but good luck earning anything.

One last note, I lose respect for Lebanese (or any foriegners) that come here, complain about how and why they hate it here, take advantage of all US has to offer andwill never leave. I'll be happy to point out what I am talking about if you can't see it.
Yalla, your turn o wise one.

[WiseCookie]

Originally Posted by JohnZ

Fine, but not related to this argument

Your words were extreme in the original thread,"I hate it here". You are not the 1st Lebanese that came here to endure immigration or earn an education. I spend 1month a year in Lebanon for the last 10 years and I have only heard a couple of people who are positive about staying in Lebanon. Everyone wants to leave, not necessarily because they don't like Lebanon but because there is not enough opportunities there. YOU made it to the US, and, to get an education. That is a huge step, well done. You are following many Lebanese that did the same thing and have suffered and made sacrifices. Many of those guys are more successful than American born Lebanese. However, if you are going to complain now you are losing my respect. You are not the only one who has suffered racism or questioning here. What about in the 80's when all the American's knew about Lebanon was hijacking, kidnapping, war, ect. Try telling people you are Lebanese here then. Questioning at the DMV? SO what, you'll be fine.
Look around at all the Lebanese people you see here in CA (I assumed that becasue you mentioned Mexico). Look at the ones who came as students and are still here now in their 30 and 40's. Most are lliving good lives. Compare that to the lives their counterparts who are living in Leb.
You said it's the same everywhere, you work, earn a full living, full stop etc. I disagree. (You are still studying, not working) Yes, you can find a good job in Leb, but good luck earning anything.

One last note, I lose respect for Lebanese (or any foriegners) that come here, complain about how and why they hate it here, take advantage of all US has to offer andwill never leave. I'll be happy to point out what I am talking about if you can't see it.
Yalla, your turn o wise one.

Alright my good friend,

First of all, I still do not know if i am going to stay in the US. I am not one of those hypocrites and I certainly do not plan on working and living here till im 30. I believe that is Lebanon's main problem. People care too much about themselves before their country. No it is not enough to go work outside and return as a rich maniac and bribe everybody while trying to find ur way into politics. It is my and every Lebanese's fault who even think about trying to leave the country. It is every single youths' fault that Lebanon is the way it is now. We have left it for the corrupt and aging and the rotten. Nothing has changed in Lebanon since the 80s u are refering too. Lebanon's repuation has not changed, and correct me if im wrong,but there's a drinking gmae actually called beirut because of the balls that are being thrown accross. I guess its like the artillery barrage.

I hate youth's who complain about Lebanon and do nothing about it. You might be mingling around people who already have families and raising children. I am talking about the youth, and the youth mentality in Lebanon that only complains and does nothing.

If the young lose hope in their country then the country is lost, and that's what's going on right now. I am certainly not in the states because i want to be in the states, but becuase the Lebanese prestige will get me a better job and salary with an american diploma and that's basically about it. If anyone youth considers himself a true patriot he will return to Lebanon. No it's not about living the good life, but it's about giving ur country a chance to stand on its own two feet. The political class is corrupt and its followers are blind. The university students who should be the liberals are more than sheep just blind zombies following whatever their leaders tell them. What do u expect from such a country if they few intellectuals travel and leave the country and turn their backs on it . I for one am not one of those people.

[LeXeU]

Originally Posted by WiseCookie

Alright my good friend,

First of all, I still do not know if i am going to stay in the US. I am not one of those hypocrites and I certainly do not plan on working and living here till im 30. I believe that is Lebanon's main problem. People care too much about themselves before their country. No it is not enough to go work outside and return as a rich maniac and bribe everybody while trying to find ur way into politics. It is my and every Lebanese's fault who even think about trying to leave the country. It is every single youths' fault that Lebanon is the way it is now. We have left it for the corrupt and aging and the rotten. Nothing has changed in Lebanon since the 80s u are refering too. Lebanon's repuation has not changed, and correct me if im wrong,but there's a drinking gmae actually called beirut because of the balls that are being thrown accross. I guess its like the artillery barrage.

I hate youth's who complain about Lebanon and do nothing about it. You might be mingling around people who already have families and raising children. I am talking about the youth, and the youth mentality in Lebanon that only complains and does nothing.

If the young lose hope in their country then the country is lost, and that's what's going on right now. I am certainly not in the states because i want to be in the states, but becuase the Lebanese prestige will get me a better job and salary with an american diploma and that's basically about it. If anyone youth considers himself a true patriot he will return to Lebanon. No it's not about living the good life, but it's about giving ur country a chance to stand on its own two feet. The political class is corrupt and its followers are blind. The university students who should be the liberals are more than sheep just blind zombies following whatever their leaders tell them. What do u expect from such a country if they few intellectuals travel and leave the country and turn their backs on it . I for one am not one of those people.

WC,

I think a big part of our youth think the same way you do. But practically, these thoughts will fail you (most of the time)! I have been living in the US for 5 years now, and I met alot of lebanese coming to the states to just study or maybe to study and get some experience and then go back to lebanon , hoping that they will be more appreciated! well, it's a myth !!!
It's a struggle, wherever you go! Many go back to lebanon becoz they fail to get a descent job and some just because they don't like it here. But then you see them after couple of months moving to the gulf area to work...

The problem is Lebanon ! No matter how much you are ready to sacrifice for your country, when you hit reality it's just very though!! Now, how long will it need Lebanon to change? Is it in our hands? How much can we do? Well, i read all the answers in your post !!!!!

I can agree with what JZ said, in the sense if you look things in less critical way, when you think of not prejudging americans and their acts, then you can probably will have more objective view about the US and its lifestyle!!

[WiseCookie]

Originally Posted by LeXeU

WC,

I think a big part of our youth think the same way you do. But practically, these thoughts will fail you (most of the time)! I have been living in the US for 5 years now, and I met alot of lebanese coming to the states to just study or maybe to study and get some experience and then go back to lebanon , hoping that they will be more appreciated! well, it's a myth !!!
It's a struggle, wherever you go! Many go back to lebanon becoz they fail to get a descent job and some just because they don't like it here. But then you see them after couple of months moving to the gulf area to work...

The problem is Lebanon ! No matter how much you are ready to sacrifice for your country, when you hit reality it's just very though!! Now, how long will it need Lebanon to change? Is it in our hands? How much can we do? Well, i read all the answers in your post !!!!!

To be honest I don't believe in a defeatist attitude. Actually it is about reality and ur willingness to change reality. I don't think that the anyone who started a revolution believed in a defeatist attitude and that reality cannot be changed.

Originally Posted by LeXeU

I can agree with what JZ said, in the sense if you look things in less critical way, when you think of not prejudging americans and their acts, then you can probably will have more objective view about the US and its lifestyle!!

I don't really think its prejudice. I'm living between them 24/7, but then again its students, perhaps they eventually change as adults.

[LeXeU]

Originally Posted by WiseCookie

To be honest I don't believe in a defeatist attitude. Actually it is about reality and ur willingness to change reality. I don't think that the anyone who started a revolution believed in a defeatist attitude and that reality cannot be changed.

It's not about the attitude! It's when a lot of people move back to get a half decent life in Lebanon and get disappointed. You know how it is! when you don't have enough connections/money, the chances are there are not so much for you to do! That is why we see the gulf countries full of Lebanese graduates!

Originally Posted by WiseCookie

I don't really think its prejudice. I'm living between them 24/7, but then again its students, perhaps they eventually change as adults.

I guess , depending on which part of the states you live makes the difference !!! How much they are used to have foreigners around them!!! And I agree some experiences might not be pleasant.

[WiseCookie]

Originally Posted by LeXeU

It's not about the attitude! It's when a lot of people move back to get a half decent life in Lebanon and get disappointed. You know how it is! when you don't have enough connections/money, the chances are there are not so much for you to do! That is why we see the gulf countries full of Lebanese graduates! .

Well interesting comment u got there, but what would u tell a person who is prepared to take a risk ?

[Sydney]

I would say Intergrate or go back to your country! I know alot of Lebanese in Australia who refuse to say they're australians, and insist on being Lebanese! Even though they were born and bread in this country. I would blame their parents who have poisened their kids with thoughts and ideas about not integrating into the western society, and to hold on into the eastern values and tradition! I would say if that's the way you want to live... seeing that we live in a democratic world... you should move back to Lebanon, where you'll be happy, and will have no conflict with the western way of life.

I would ask every person who have migrated to a western country, why is it that they do not want to integrate, respect and love the country, who hosted them, offered them a better opportunity in life, offered them security and safety!?

Unless you are in the country Temporarily... on a student visa, or just on a business venture ... I reckon a person should assimilate and integrate!

[Gabriel]

Sydney .. trust me my friend, ma fe a7la mn innak tkoon sharqi. This world is coloured by the East. No matter how long you stay outside the Eastern socities, your blood, and soul remains Eastern, atleast to me :)

[JB81]

The whole point can anyone define the difference between western/eastern life ?

[WiseCookie]

Originally Posted by Sydney

I would say Intergrate or go back to your country! I know alot of Lebanese in Australia who refuse to say they're australians, and insist on being Lebanese! Even though they were born and bread in this country. I would blame their parents who have poisened their kids with thoughts and ideas about not integrating into the western society, and to hold on into the eastern values and tradition! I would say if that's the way you want to live... seeing that we live in a democratic world... you should move back to Lebanon, where you'll be happy, and will have no conflict with the western way of life.

I would ask every person who have migrated to a western country, why is it that they do not want to integrate, respect and love the country, who hosted them, offered them a better opportunity in life, offered them security and safety!?

Unless you are in the country Temporarily... on a student visa, or just on a business venture ... I reckon a person should assimilate and integrate!

Are u lebanese-australian or just australian ? There's a difference between denying ur identity, and just living in another country.